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To: ealgeone

God said to honor your Father and Mother. the Blessed Mother is our spiritual mother and the the Mother of God. We honor her and pray to her and all the holy ones. Ephesians 6:18

The Blessed Mother without sin is closer to God than the rest of us and helped Jesus in our salvation. Jesus is our judge, and the Blessed Mother is our advocate who pleads our cause.

Protestants should find in their hearts to honor and love the Blessed Mother.


60 posted on 10/19/2019 4:36:22 AM PDT by ADSUM
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To: ADSUM
God said to honor your Father and Mother.

Actually, He said this...continuing to illustrate the need to go to the Scriptures in dealing with the Roman Catholic:

Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be prolonged in the land which the LORD your God gives you. Ex 20:12 NASB

The intent of this passage was to honor your earthly father and mother. Notice the words are not in caps as you did. Even the official Bible of Roman Catholicism doesn't put them in caps.

the Blessed Mother is our spiritual mother and the Mother of God.

And again the need for context.

Here is what Luke actually recorded.

48“For He has had regard for the humble state of His bondslave; For behold, from this time on all generations will count me blessed. Luke 1:48 NASB

Will count in the Greek is a verb. It is NOT a title as Roman Catholicism tries to falsley claim. We honor her and pray to her and all the holy ones. Ephesians 6:18

Scripture never records Mary as being the "mother of God". That only came about in 431 at the Council of Ephesus where they were debating the nature of Christ. The resulting "mother of God" from that Council was to give clarity to the nature of Christ....not to honor Mary as Rome has wrongly asserted.

Mary is not our "spiritual mother".

Roman Catholics try to claim Jesus gave Mary to everyone based on John 19:27.

However, if Rome's priests studied the Greek they'd know this is not the case.

The Greek word used here for own is ἴδια. It conveys the following meaning:

2398 ídios (a primitive word, NAS dictionary) – properly, uniquely one's own, peculiar to the individual. 2398 /ídios ("uniquely one's own") is "stronger than the simple possessive pronoun ('own'). This emphatic adjective means 'private, personal' " (WS, 222).

This was a private matter. Mary was placed in John's care. Nothing more. Nothing less.

To attempt to read back into the passage something else is eisegesis.

As far as Mary helping Jesus in our salvation.

Again...no.

Only He was beaten.

Only He was cursed.

Only He wore a crown of thorns.

Only He was crucified.

Only He was resurrected.

Only Jesus.

17“For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life so that I may take it again. 18“No one has taken it away from Me, but I lay it down on My own initiative. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This commandment I received from My Father.” John 10:17-18 NASB

******

We honor her and pray to her and all the holy ones. Ephesians 6:18

And again context is key here. In the passage dealing with spiritual warfare in Ephesians 6:10-20, Paul begins the section as follows:

10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might.

In these verses the emphasis is on relying upon God in spiritual warefar.

The verse you cited, 6:18 is this.... With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints,

No where in this passage is Paul suggesting we pray TO anyone other than God.

In fact, no where in the NT are we ever given instruction to pray to anyone other than to God. Though I will give you credit for being honest in saying Roman Catholics pray TO Mary....something many of your fellow RCs have denied on these forums.

When Jesus was in the Garden, did He seek out Mary for council? Nope.

He went to the Father.

1Jesus spoke these things; and lifting up His eyes to heaven, He said, “Father, the hour has come; glorify Your Son, that the Son may glorify You, 2even as You gave Him authority over all flesh, that to all whom You have given Him, He may give eternal life. 3“This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. 4“I glorified You on the earth, having accomplished the work which You have given Me to do. 5“Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was. John 17:1-5

Just before this He told the disciples the following:

23“In that day you will not question Me about anything. Truly, truly, I say to you, if you ask the Father for anything in My name, He will give it to you. John 16:23

Again, Jesus points to the Father in matters of prayer.

The false writings I posted from Roman Catholic writers previously stands in contradiction of the words of the Son....that is the writings of the Roman Catholics writers are false...as is your assertion as to whom we are to pray to and who is our advocate.

When the disciples asked Jesus to teach them to pray....what did He teach them? The consecration prayer to Mary?

Nope.

The Hail Mary? Nope.

He taught them this:

9“Pray, then, in this way: ‘Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. 10‘Your kingdom come. Your will be done, On earth as it is in heaven. 11‘Give us this day our daily bread. 12‘And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. 13‘And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from evil. [For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.’] 14“For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15“But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions. Matt 6:9-15

All prayer is directed to the Creator....not the created.

Scripture is clear on this.

********

The Blessed Mother without sin is closer to God than the rest of us and helped Jesus in our salvation.

Nope.

You think proximity matters in terms of how God hears us?

Again, this shows a lack of understanding of exactly what He has done for us. Paul notes:

13For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, 14in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. Colossians 1:13-14

As far as Mary being sinless....well, we've about beat that one so much I won't go into detail but suffice to say the Roman Catholic position contradicts both Old and New Testaments but also violates its own "unanimous consent" among the ECFs as there is NO unanimous consent on this issue among the ECFs.

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, Romans 3:23

When they sin against You--for there is no one who does not sin--and You become angry with them and deliver them to an enemy who takes them as captives to his own land, whether far or near, 1 Kings 8:46

Surely there is no righteous man on earth who does good and never sins. Ecclesiastes 7:20

******

Jesus is our judge, and the Blessed Mother is our advocate who pleads our cause.

Wow. The blasphemy against the Son and Spirit is unbelievable. I really cannot believe you wrote this. You're a trained Roman Catholic priest....right?

The Holy Spirit is our Advocate as is Jesus.

The believer does not come under judgment in the sense of being judged for Heaven or Hell.

18“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. John 3:18 NASB

******

Christians can learn this from Mary (as they can others in the NT).

She was obedient to God. Luke 1:38

She knew the Scriptures. Luke 1:46-55

She recognized God as her Savior Luke 1:47

She gave praise to the Lord. Luke 1:46 She had faith in her Son. Jn 2:5

63 posted on 10/19/2019 5:25:44 AM PDT by ealgeone
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