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To: Bayard
Then you might or might not know that Porneias translated as "unchastitiy" in the NASB from Greek means more then simply "unchastity." It includes a range of sexual immorality such as incest ect, which are expressly forbidden in Lev 20:11-17 and elsewhere.

Yes, πορνεία, meaning pornography, pornographic"; cf. 4205 /pórnos) which is derived from pernaō, "to sell off") – properly, a selling off (surrendering) of sexual purity; promiscuity of any (every) type.

However, that is not the meaning of the Roman Catholic usage.

Rome expands that definition.

But the term is used properly within the confines of a marriage whereby one partner is cheating on another.

Rome has said an "unlawful" marriage includes things such as no intention of having children (which would really complicate Joseph and Mary's marriage), among others.

Some of these other "unlawful" reasons include:

too young (which again would raise problems for Joseph and Mary)

no intention of being faithful(after the marriage act)

lack of form

previously married

None of those reasons are provided for in Scripture.

However the word appears again in other parts of scripture to mean more then mere unchastity. Paul uses the word in reference to incest 1 cor 5:1, but it can mean any kind of sexual immorality.

Yes, that would be what we'd call "cheating" or unfaithfulness today.

From one of Msgr Pope's articles( https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinion/jesus-rejected-unlawful-and-unchaste-marriages-in-his-own-day-heres-why-and).

Now the phrases, “unless the marriage is unlawful” and “except for unchastity,” are translations of the Greek phrase μὴ ἐπὶ πορνείᾳ (me epi porneia).

The Msgr may know his Latin, but he doesn't know his Greek.

The phrase would be properly translated "except for sexual immorality."

There is nothing in the verse to support the claim of "unless the marriage is unlawful".

Using biblegateway and a search of all English translation of Matthew 19:9 shows the NABRE is the only translation to render the passage in this manner.

The NABRE has added something to scripture not supported in the Greek texts.

78 posted on 09/03/2019 4:59:18 PM PDT by ealgeone
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To: ealgeone
Yes, πορνεία, meaning pornography, pornographic"; cf. 4205 /pórnos) which is derived from pernaō, "to sell off") – properly, a selling off (surrendering) of sexual purity; promiscuity of any (every) type.

Sexual immorality of every type is a broad reference. That means every type of unlawful sexual union prescribed elsewhere in scripture.

However, that is not the meaning of the Roman Catholic usage.

Rome expands that definition.

But the term is used properly within the confines of a marriage whereby one partner is cheating on another.

Note in the context of "Porneia" which is a broad definition of the sense of "cheating." It includes rape and incest and prostitution. Basically any type of unlawful sexual union prescribed elsewhere in other passages of sacred scripture.

Rome has said an "unlawful" marriage includes things such as no intention of having children (which would really complicate Joseph and Mary's marriage), among others.

You're mistaking the teaching of "no intention of having children." This is a mistake especially as it applies to Joseph and Mary since they clearly had one child, even though Joseph was not the biological father. We both would agree that Jesus is the Son of God the Father. We both would also believe that He is also the Son of Mary. Their example would clearly be allowed in Canon Law. Unless you have a specific Canon that says otherwise?

Some of these other "unlawful" reasons include: too young (which again would raise problems for Joseph and Mary)

What ages would you be describing Joseph and Mary? Is there scripture on how old Mary was?

Also, Canon Law has a given age, but it does not stipulate that requirement to be a matter of divine law. What would be prescribed is if the youth of that partner was such that they had not had the faculty of reason.

The Msgr may know his Latin, but he doesn't know his Greek.

The phrase would be properly translated "except for sexual immorality."

There is nothing in the verse to support the claim of "unless the marriage is unlawful".

While I'm not Msgnr Pope. I do agree with his definition though, since Sexual Immorality described in scripture is also the same thing as saying Unlawful sexual practice. Biblically speaking, there is no real difference between the two, since sexual immorality is a sin, hence it is also unlawful in God's eyes to engage in it.

80 posted on 09/03/2019 6:10:07 PM PDT by Bayard
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