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Cardinal Dolan: We’re Not Going To Excommunicate Cuomo Over Abortion Bill
Hotair ^
| 01/31/2019
| Ed Morrissey
Posted on 01/31/2019 6:59:20 AM PST by SeekAndFind
Not even if Andrew Cuomo seems ready to shift from abortion to infanticide? No, says New York City’s Cardinal Timothy Dolan, who complains in this clip from The Catholic Channel about the “far right” demanding such action. “Excommunication should not be used as a weapon,” Dolan argues, and points out that canon law in the Catholic Church doesn’t support such an action anyway.
Besides, Dolan argues, it might give Cuomo exactly what he wants — a kind of secular martyrdom:
“Notable canon lawyers have said that, under canon law, excommunication is not an appropriate response to a politician who supports or votes for legislation advancing abortion,” said the statement, which laid out “general principles” and did not address any specific individual.
“From a pastoral perspective, if a pastor — and a bishop is certainly a pastor of a diocese — knows of a grave situation involving a parishioner, it is his duty to address that issue personally and directly with the parishioner,” it said, adding that this is the approach of Cardinal Dolan as it was of his predecessors as New York’s archbishop, the late Cardinal John J. O’Connor and the late Cardinal Edward M. Egan.
I’m a great admirer of Cardinal Dolan, but he’s wrong here, and wrong to cast this as a “far right” issue as well. Dolan’s not incorrect about the issue with canon law, which is as binding on the episcopacy as much as Catholics in the pews. Last week, I wrote a lengthy explanation of the difficulties in using excommunication over political positions, difficulties which Dolan would understand in much greater detail than a member of the laity.
In brief, canon law and the catechism hold that procuring or directly assisting in the procurement of an abortion amounts to an excommunicative act “latae sententiae,” or in the commission of the act. In other words, it doesn’t take a bishop or the Vatican to issue a declaration of excommunication under those circumstances — it happens on its own. But that only applies to specific acts of abortion and specific acts of facilitation thereof, not votes or political positions in general.
Beyond that, though, Dolan argues that it’s a “strategic” mistake as well as tactically impossible:
“From a strategic perspective,” excommunication is not effective because “many politicians would welcome it as a sign of their refusal to be ‘bullied by the church,’ thinking it would therefore give them a political advantage,” the statement said.
As an example of this “political advantage,” it cited how in 1989, Bishop Leo T. Maher, then head of the Diocese of San Diego, gained national attention when he forbade California Senate candidate Lucy Killea, a state assemblywoman, from receiving Communion because of her support for legal abortion, which had become a prominent feature of her campaign.
Well, maybe. Having one politician win one election isn’t much more than an anecdote. The dangers of having the Cuomos and Nancy Pelosis continuing to represent themselves as pro-abortion Catholics — to the point of celebrating the grotesque legalization of abortion up to the moment of birth — goes beyond elections anyway. These high-profile Catholics lead others astray on Catholic teaching on life (and family issues too, for that matter), and the lack of formal response bolsters that impact. If Cuomo remains in good standing with the church after last week, other Catholics might rightly assume that they also can pick and choose which teachings they’ll abide and which they won’t without any consequences.
The “far right” is hardly the only group who’s noticed that Cuomo has begun to “brag … about his dissent from timeless and substantive church belief” even without punitive action within the church. A New York Post op-ed took Cuomo to task for that as well as misrepresenting Pope Francis and blaming the bishops for a failure of a bill on sexual abuse of minors.
Then our governor insults and caricatures the church in whats supposed to be an uplifting and unifying occasion, his State of the State address.
The bishops of this state have long supported a reform of the inadequate laws around the sexual abuse of minors. Yes, we and many others expressed reservations about one element, the retroactive elimination of the civil statute of limitations, but urged dramatic reform that, in many ways, was tougher than what was being proposed by legislators. A month ago we renewed that stance, and even dropped our objections to the look-back section if all victims would benefit. The governor was aware of all this.
Why, then, would he use his address to blame the church, and only the church, for blocking this bill? Why would he publicly brag in a political address about his dissent from timeless and substantive church belief? Why would he quote Pope Francis out of context as an applause line to misrepresent us bishops here as being opposed to our Holy Father? Why did he reduce the sexual abuse of minors, a broad societal and cultural curse that afflicts every family, public school, religion and government program, to a Catholic problem?
Im a pastor, not a politician, but I feel obliged to ask these questions, as daily do I hear them from my people, as well as colleagues from other creeds. Ive been attacked in the past when I asked sadly and reluctantly if the party that my folks proudly claimed as their own, the Democrats, had chosen to alienate faithful Catholic voters. Now you know why I asked.
Does this description sound like a politician who has any desire to remain in communion with the Catholic Church? Not at all. Want to know who wrote this? That figure of the “far right,” Cardinal Timothy Dolan.
The answer may not be excommunication under Canon 1398, but the Catholic Church has to answer Cuomo somehow. Wringing hands on The Catholic Channel is all well and good, but it’s clearly not more effective than what Bishop Maher did with Lucy Killea. In fact, as Cuomo slouches towards straight-out infanticide, it’s become clear that ignoring the issue of pro-abortion Catholic politicians over the last five decades has only made things worse — much much worse.
It’s time for the bishops to come up with a formal process to deal with this problem, whether based on Canon 1398 or a new canon law that directly touches on the issue. That process should be just, provide opportunities for mercy and conversion, but make it clear that embracing the culture of death means making a choice to leave the communion of the Catholic Church. That’s not “bullying” — it’s accountability, especially in Cuomo’s case.
TOPICS: Catholic; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: abortion; andrewcuomo; cardinaldolan; excommunication
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To: SeekAndFind
Well, what does it take then?
What’s the point of having official church doctrine or teaching if you’re going to refuse to enforce it?
It’s meaningless.
81
posted on
01/31/2019 12:44:47 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: SeekAndFind
Non-Catholics can’t excommunicate non-Catholics.
82
posted on
01/31/2019 1:35:21 PM PST
by
piusv
To: metmom
Whats the point of having official church doctrine or teaching if youre going to refuse to enforce it? Its meaningless.
Bingo. We have a winner.
If Andrew Cuomo can cause the slaughter of huge numbers of babies and remain a Catholic in good standing, then I can [cheat on my wife][steal from my employer][lie in court papers][hate my neighbor][fill in the blank]and do the same.
To: JonPreston
Please don't stop going to Mass. You and I NEED the sacrament!! It's another matter if you don't think you should give support to the corrupt hierarchy.
Cardinal Dolan is a Pillsbury doughboy on moral issues. Not all the shepherds are that bad, but, yes, we are embarrassed and scandalized by the bad ones. I have hope because I believe the prophecies that this will get straightened out, after we suffer a bunch.
To: budj
“...name the Catholic church where abortion, infanticide and gay marriage are just fine - as long as you keep donating...”
Bingo! We have a winner!
Easy: name the church where cuomo goes!
85
posted on
01/31/2019 2:36:24 PM PST
by
Grampa Dave
(Liberals//GOPe's 2019 Strategy, mantra, plan = 'No Borders, No Walls, No USA at All!)
To: SeekAndFind
Cardinal Dolan has no intestinal fortitude. Pray for him. Just like the Catholic Church has an abuse crisis and will not face what has to be done, Cardinal Dolan will not do what has to be done. The Church allows the queer priests to remain in the ministry and Cardinal Dolan allows Governor Cuomo to remain in the Church. Both are remiss!
To: Missouri gal
I cannot agree with you more.
To: SeekAndFind
Dolan has effectively excommunicated himself with his negligence.
88
posted on
01/31/2019 4:16:12 PM PST
by
Fedora
To: Missouri gal; JonPreston
Please don't stop going to Mass. You and I NEED the sacrament!! No, all anyone needs is Jesus, and He isn't in our lives by eating Him.
All that's needed to be saved is faith/belief.
Salvation by grace by believing
John 1:10-13 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
John 3:3-8 Jesus answered him,Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus said to him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born? Jesus answered, Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, You must be born again. The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.
John 3:14-18 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
John 6:40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.
John 11:25-26 Jesus said to her, I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?
John 20:30-31 Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
Acts 16:27-31 When the jailer woke and saw that the prison doors were open, he drew his sword and was about to kill himself, supposing that the prisoners had escaped. But Paul cried with a loud voice, Do not harm yourself, for we are all here. And the jailer called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas. Then he brought them out and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.
2 Corinthians 6:2 For he says, In a favorable time I listened to you, and in a day of salvation I have helped you. Behold, now is the favorable time; behold, now is the day of salvation.
Romans 10:9-13 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame. For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
89
posted on
01/31/2019 4:16:25 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: stanne
He said He would never abandon the Church. So He wont. He doesn't have to abandon Roman Catholicism.
It has abandoned HIM.
90
posted on
01/31/2019 4:20:15 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: SeekAndFind
What a joke the Catholic hierarchy has become....
Do they stand for anything anymore
Its very discouraging
91
posted on
01/31/2019 4:20:27 PM PST
by
wardaddy
(Progressive winter is coming.)
To: Bigg Red
The Gates of Hell shall not prevail against Christs Church. And they won't, so what we see calling itself Catholicism, is clearly not Christ's church.
92
posted on
01/31/2019 4:22:52 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: metmom
93
posted on
01/31/2019 4:25:55 PM PST
by
stanne
To: metmom
[48] I am the bread of life. [49] Your fathers did eat manna in the desert, and are dead. [50] This is the bread which cometh down from heaven; that if any man eat of it, he may not die.
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven. [52] If any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever; and the bread that I will give, is my flesh, for the life of the world.
John Chapter 6
94
posted on
01/31/2019 4:26:10 PM PST
by
ebb tide
(We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
To: JonPreston
95
posted on
01/31/2019 4:26:34 PM PST
by
wardaddy
(Progressive winter is coming.)
To: Bishop_Malachi
One wonders how the Apostles would have dealt with a Church-member who advocated for laws encouraging adultery, infanticide, or homosexuality.
Acts 5:1-11 But a man named Ananias, with his wife Sapphira, sold a piece of property, and with his wife's knowledge he kept back for himself some of the proceeds and brought only a part of it and laid it at the apostles' feet. But Peter said, Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back for yourself part of the proceeds of the land? While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not at your disposal? Why is it that you have contrived this deed in your heart? You have not lied to man but to God. When Ananias heard these words, he fell down and breathed his last. And great fear came upon all who heard of it. The young men rose and wrapped him up and carried him out and buried him.
After an interval of about three hours his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. And Peter said to her, Tell me whether you sold the land for so much. And she said, Yes, for so much. But Peter said to her, How is it that you have agreed together to test the Spirit of the Lord? Behold, the feet of those who have buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out. Immediately she fell down at his feet and breathed her last. When the young men came in they found her dead, and they carried her out and buried her beside her husband. And great fear came upon the whole church and upon all who heard of these things.
And then there are these instructions from Paul about immorality in the church.
1 Corinthians 5:1-13 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.
For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.
Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? Cleanse out the old leaven that you may be a new lump, as you really are unleavened. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. Let us therefore celebrate the festival, not with the old leaven, the leaven of malice and evil, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral peoplenot at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindlernot even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you.
96
posted on
01/31/2019 4:28:55 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: Ge0ffrey
What we need at this point is a parishioner at whatever church he attends to film Cuomo receiving the Eucharist, and then posting it on line. And that's going to do exactly what?
97
posted on
01/31/2019 4:33:21 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: metmom
And they won't, so what we see calling itself Catholicism, is clearly not Christ's church. Who are the "we" you are referring to? What specific denominations are you claiming to speak for?
98
posted on
01/31/2019 4:38:48 PM PST
by
ebb tide
(We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
To: ebb tide
And at the end of His discourse, He clearly tells the disciples that He was speaking figuratively.
John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
99
posted on
01/31/2019 4:39:06 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
To: ebb tide
Anybody in general.
Religious or not.
It’s clear to anyone who reads the news and knows what Catholicism claims ti stands for.
They stand for nothing as evidenced by their inaction in light of liberal politicians, democrat voting laity, pedo priests, giving Catholic funerals to the likes of Kennedy and Chavez.
Aside from a few scattered laity who are desperately clinging to the faith and unlikely hope that somehow things might go back to what they should be, Catholicism has wholesale abandoned any pretense of being Christian or obeying God.
100
posted on
01/31/2019 4:43:52 PM PST
by
metmom
( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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