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To: Mom MD

Looked it up. Peter is the guy Jesus was talking to.


53 posted on 08/22/2018 2:02:04 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Just the facts, ma'am, just the facts." - Sgt. Joe Friday)
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To: Mrs. Don-o; Mom MD
And Jesus never told Peter that on *YOU* (meaning Peter) He would build his church.

Peter himself says that Christ is the rock and Paul also clearly states that. Matthew 16:18 - http://bible.cc/matthew/16-18.htm

Jesus said that Peter was *petros*(masculine) and that on this *petra*(feminine) He would build His church.

Greek: 4074 Pétros (a masculine noun) – properly, a stone (pebble), such as a small rock found along a pathway. 4074 /Pétros (”small stone”) then stands in contrast to 4073 /pétra (”cliff, boulder,” Abbott-Smith).

“4074 (Pétros) is an isolated rock and 4073 (pétra) is a cliff” (TDNT, 3, 100). “4074 (Pétros) always means a stone . . . such as a man may throw, . . . versus 4073 (pétra), a projecting rock, cliff” (S. Zodhiates, Dict).

4073 pétra (a feminine noun) – “a mass of connected rock,” which is distinct from 4074 (Pétros) which is “a detached stone or boulder” (A-S). 4073 (pétra) is a “solid or native rock, rising up through the earth” (Souter) – a huge mass of rock (a boulder), such as a projecting cliff.

4073 (petra) is “a projecting rock, cliff (feminine noun) . . . 4074 (petros, the masculine form) however is a stone . . . such as a man might throw” (S. Zodhiates, Dict).

It’s also a strange way to word the sentence that He would call Peter a rock and say that on this I will build my church instead of *on you* as would be grammatically correct in talking to a person.

There is no support from the original Greek that Peter was to be the rock on which Jesus said he would build His church. The nouns are not the same, one being masculine and the other being feminine. They denote different objects.

Also, here, Paul identifies who petra is, and that is Christ. This link takes you to the Greek.

http://biblehub.com/text/1_corinthians/10-4.htm

1 Corinthians 10:1-4 For I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea, and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, and all ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank from the spiritual Rock (petra) that followed them, and the Rock (petra) was Christ.

http://biblehub.com/text/romans/9-33.htm

Romans 9:30-33 What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, a righteousness that is by faith; but that Israel who pursued a law that would lead to righteousness did not succeed in reaching that law. Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone, as it is written,“Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone of stumbling, and a rock (petra) of offense; and whoever believes in him will not be put to shame.”

http://biblehub.com/text/1_peter/2-8.htm

1 Peter 2:1-8 So put away all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander. Like newborn infants, long for the pure spiritual milk, that by it you may grow up into salvation— if indeed you have tasted that the Lord is good.

As you come to him, a living stone rejected by men but in the sight of God chosen and precious, you yourselves like living stones are being built up as a spiritual house, to be a holy priesthood, to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. For it stands in Scripture: “Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a cornerstone chosen and precious, and whoever believes in him will not be put to shame.”

So the honor is for you who believe, but for those who do not believe,

“The stone that the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,”

and

“A stone of stumbling, and a rock (petra) of offense.

They stumble because they disobey the word, as they were destined to do.

All occurrences of *petra* in the Greek.

http://biblehub.com/greek/strongs_4073.htm

62 posted on 08/22/2018 2:10:52 PM PDT by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

We have been over this before and will never see eye to eye. Nothing will prevail against the saints let’s leave it there


69 posted on 08/22/2018 2:22:04 PM PDT by Mom MD ( .)
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To: Mrs. Don-o; Mom MD; metmom
Looked it up. Peter is the guy Jesus was talking to.

Yes...one verse theology. It always leads to bad theology. As another example the wedding at Cana.....Roman Catholicism has taken one verse out of John and turned Mary into a demi-goddess.

If you read ahead to Acts, you will see how Peter, and the other disciples, exercised this.

37Now when they heard this, they were pierced to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brethren, what shall we do?” 38Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:37-38 NASB

Now tie this back into the passage from Matthew 16.

13Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” 14And they said, “Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets.” 15He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18“I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. 19“I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.” 20Then He warned the disciples that they should tell no one that He was the Christ. Matthew 16:13-20 NASB

Now, this exchange is also recorded in Mark and Luke.

And He continued by questioning them, “But who do you say that I am?” Peter *answered and *said to Him, “You are the Christ.” Mark 8:29 NASB

And He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” And Peter answered and said, “The Christ of God.” Luke 9:20 NASB

The emphasis of this exchange is Peter's confession.....Jesus is the Christ.

This is the message the church is built upon....Jesus is the Christ.

This is the message Peter and the disciples preached beginning at Pentecost and going forward.

It is the same message Paul preached in his ministries.

It is the same message conveyed by every believer in Christ since the 1st century.

The OT writers understood their salvation was from God and that He was the rock.

It is a clear consistent message from beginning to end.

Why? Because He is the Alpha and the Omega.

The NT is crystal clear....we can only gain Heaven through faith in Christ and Christ alone....no one or no other thing will gain us Heaven.

Any other message that says otherwise is a false gospel and is to be shunned.

84 posted on 08/22/2018 5:42:35 PM PDT by ealgeone (SCRIPTURE DOES NOT CHANGE!)
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