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To: ADSUM

I’m not a Calvinist, but I did like Calvin and Hobbs, and I have often wondered about this.

If God is omniscient then he, by definition, knows everything. By extension that means he knows what we are all thinking and what decisions we will make in our lives. So whether he predetermines or not, he knows. If someone, i.e. God, knows what is going to happen with complete certainty isn’t that pretty close to our lives being predetermined?


12 posted on 05/26/2018 7:40:24 AM PDT by redangus (actually hit her?)
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To: redangus

No. While God knows all things, He does not make our decisions. We make our own choices.

He allows us to make our own choices. We can chose to be members of the Church that Jesus founded, or follow a man made religion like Calvin. Jesus warned us about false teachers and He was the Truth that we should follow.


20 posted on 05/26/2018 8:04:25 AM PDT by ADSUM
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To: redangus

[[If someone, i.e. God, knows what is going to happen with complete certainty isn’t that pretty close to our lives being predetermined?]]

No not really- He foreknows how a man’s free will will choose- He doesn’t force that person to make the decision. He doesn’t predetermine how they will choose- He does however Foreknow- If I know how someone will respond, I don’t control how they choose- but just know how they will choose something-

Predestination is a tough subject- in a sense, we are ‘predestined to accept or reject’ the will of God- but that is not to suggest we don’t have control of how we will eventually choose- We still exhibit free will even though the outcome is foreknown by God. God brings all the circumstances necessary fro salvation into our lives- and we ultimately choose- We can’t say “I was never meant to be saved, so I give up and won’t even try to find God’ Because everything necessary to find Him is available to us personally-

While predestination appears to be fatalistic (ie I have no real choice because my life is laid out long before I was ever born) it isn’t- God certainly knows how we will choose- but He provides all the necessary evidences for us to choose wisely if we so choose to- Even though our live’s directions are foreknown- God simply foreknows how we will choose- He doesn’t force anyone to choose against their free will- I

In a sense God predestines, or predetermines the circumstances (the circumstances that allow everyone to know enough about God to either choose or reject) that we will encounter in our lives- He controls the circumstances that affect our free will

God predestines Christ dying on the cross (Christ was willing to die) in order to bring salvation to all. I suppose in a sense Christ could have refused- But being the all loving God that He is- He CHOSE to die for us all- His nature compelled Him to do so

People who reject God choose to do God’s will in the sense thaT God uses evil people to accomplish His will- He doesn’t force these evil people to reject Him- But since He knew they would, He directs circumstances to use the evil for good top accomplish His will. These people would never accept God no matter what is placed before them because they have hardened their hearts against Him- and God knows this and uses their evil actions for specific purposes

It’s like if i know how someone is going to react- I will prepare things so that their decision, which was preknown by me, will further my goal

Since God knows we will accept Him- He prepares ‘good works for us so that we can walk in them’- He makes it possible for us to make the right choices

Again- this is a tough subject-, and reading books like Pinjk’s ‘The Sovereignty of God’ can be very depressing, leading one to think we have no choice in our decisions- and making it seem like God created people to reject Him without giving them a chance to accept Him- but this isn’t the case


46 posted on 05/26/2018 9:29:47 AM PDT by Bob434
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