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To: srweaver

No, I am not saying that at all.

That’s not the position I hold.

However, God loving all of His creatures that He created equally does not mean by default that He is going to save them. He has given man the option to accept His offer of salvation or reject it.


36 posted on 12/20/2017 9:26:32 AM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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To: metmom

I’m not saying that is the position you hold, or even what you think – which I don’t know.

But you state: “He has given man the option to accept His offer of salvation or reject it.”

However, the position of Calvinism and Reformed theology is that God, in His eternal counsels and by His sovereign decrees, chose, elected, appointed, ordained, etc., some to eternal life and others to eternal damnation.

This was not based on His foreknowledge of His creatures’ responses to the gospel, or on any action that the “elect” would or would not take in the future, during his or her life, but merely because God picked some for salvation and condemned others to damnation.

While I agree that these concepts are “fuzzy” in the minds of many who claim Calvinism/Reformed theology, Calvin’s writings and Reformed theologians/teachers, e.g. John Piper, leave NO DOUBT that people are either unconditionally elected (absent any action/inaction/faith/unbelief on THEIR part) or unconditionally rejected (absent any action/inaction/faith/unbelief on THEIR part) because all are totally depraved and totally unable to respond to God’s “gracious,” but, obviously, not bona fide offer of salvation. Only those God has picked (chosen, elected, ordained, etc.) CAN respond. Others do not REALLY have that choice, because they will do what their nature (ACCORDING TO GOD’S ETERNAL DECREE) dictates. Jesus did not die for all, or to save all (limited atonement) but only for some – the scriptures notwithstanding.

What I am trying to understand is how my fellow believers, who are Calvinist, think that God loves (defined as wanting the best for them) all men. Or believe that he actually legitimately offers salvation to all men, women, and children (if they do think that, which I find hard to believe). It really has to do with the character of God, whom Calvinists teach ordained people to eternal death (or life), by His eternal decrees, apart from those people freely choosing to accept or reject Him, i.e, freely choosing faith or unbelief, absent any internal or external (God’s decree) restraint.

Could you explain that, or any Calvinists reading this post?


38 posted on 12/20/2017 10:07:27 AM PST by srweaver (Never Forget the Judicial Homicide of Terri Schiavo)
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