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To: boatbums
No they are not seen in their proper light at all. Everytime someone brings them up on here the chorus begins its tired refrain "they're not Scripture! they're not Scripture!".

When most of the time no one is bringing them up *as Scripture*, people are just bringing them up as evidence of what the early Church believed and how it was organized and acted.

Name me one Church Father whose theology is identifiably Protestant.

One.

51 posted on 06/20/2017 3:57:01 AM PDT by Claud
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To: Claud

It might be possible to find all of Luther’s thoughts in Clement.


74 posted on 06/20/2017 11:05:11 AM PDT by MHGinTN (A dispensational perspective is a powerful tool for discernment)
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To: Claud
When most of the time no one is bringing them up *as Scripture*, people are just bringing them up as evidence of what the early Church believed and how it was organized and acted.

Maybe you didn't understand the point that "tradition", whether Sacred or regular, is not equal to Divinely-inspired Scripture. When a church such as Catholicism declares a certain doctrine as binding upon all Christians, then they SHOULD be able to prove that this was a truth that had been taught by the Apostles. Doesn't Catholicism claim to be "apostolic"?

Name me one Church Father whose theology is identifiably Protestant. One.

Here's a thought...read some of the writings of Protestant Church Historians. They do an excellent job of showing that the reformation doctrines were primitive and TRULY catholic. From Schaff's History of the Christian Church:

V. The Protestant Church historians.

The Reformation of the sixteenth century is the mother of church history as a science and art in the proper sense of term. It seemed at first to break off from the past and to depreciate church history, by going back directly to the Bible as the only rule of faith and practice, and especially to look most unfavorably on the Catholic middle age, as a progressive corruption of the apostolic doctrine and discipline. But, on the other hand, it exalted primitive Christianity, and awakened a new and enthusiastic interest in all the documents of the apostolic church, with an energetic effort to reproduce its spirit and institutions. It really repudiated only the later tradition in favor of the older, taking its stand upon the primitive historical basis of Christianity. Then again, in the course of controversy with Rome, Protestantism found it desirable and necessary to wrest from its opponent not only the scriptural argument, but also the historical, and to turn it as far as possible to the side of the evangelical cause. For the Protestants could never deny that the true Church of Christ is built on a rock, and has the promise of indestructible permanence. Finally, the Reformation, by, liberating the mind from the yoke of a despotic ecclesiastical authority, gave an entirely new impulse, directly or indirectly to free investigation in every department, and produced that historical criticism which claims to clear fact from the accretions of fiction, and to bring out the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, of history. Of course this criticism may run to the extreme of rationalism and scepticism, which oppose the authority of the apostles and of Christ himself; as it actually did for a time, especially in Germany. But the abuse of free investigation proves nothing against the right use of it; and is to be regarded only as a temporary aberration, from which all sound minds will return to a due appreciation of history, as a truly rational unfolding of the plan of redemption, and a standing witness for the all-ruling providence of God, and the divine character of the Christian religion.

77 posted on 06/20/2017 6:43:55 PM PDT by boatbums (The Law is a storm which wrecks your hopes of self-salvation, but washes you upon the Rock of Ages)
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To: Claud; daniel1212

More than one.

God must have invented duct tape much earlier than you've been led to believe. (that's a joke, son)

Hey! knock it off with the attributing motives sort of thing. Seriously. That's forbidden on the religion forum because it can lead to flame-wars.

In other news daniell1212 has not "steadfastly refused" to go down that road, either. Just because it cannot be summed up in a few paragraphs does not mean the road cannot be traveled.

Many of us here have been traveling that road for years, and have not found particular theological consideration & practices peculiar to Roman Catholicism. For example; such as there being one superlative bishop of bishops -- one singular "pope" --- having been part of the early church from the very beginning --- Romish sophistry regarding the apostle Peter's own personal role notwithstanding, for reason that most any and all bishops of the early church were seen as successors to Peter, and to Paul, and all the rest -- catholically, universally & collectively. There are well-informed Roman Catholic historians that agree with that assessment.

For other items (beyond sola fide) to be established could require additional & quite lengthy documentation.

80 posted on 07/21/2017 5:56:06 AM PDT by BlueDragon (whattya' mean you don't believe in Climate Change? the weather always seems to be changing...)
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