Posted on 04/01/2016 12:41:08 PM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
Mormonism
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Catholicism
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Beatcha by 27 days!
And how did her seeing eye dog treat you?
Didn't even make a dent, caused great danger for themselves however.
Nah...
..this is WAY too easy.
We’ll now accept your traditions and Mary apparitions...
Altered from what, the true KJV???
You 7 Catholic churches in Asia!!
Why you B so messed up???
Listen to the words of a famous Catholic from yesteryear...
"One indeed is the universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved, in which the priest himself is the sacrifice, Jesus Christ, whose body and blood are truly contained in the sacrament of the altar under the species of bread and wine; the bread (changed) into His body by the divine power of transubstantiation, and the wine into the blood, so that to accomplish the mystery of unity we ourselves receive from His (nature) what He Himself received from ours."
--Pope Innocent III and Lateran Council IV (A.D. 1215)
Of course it is clear I asserted no such thing.
I will say that many are ignorant of the Gospel message of salvation, being born again and having a personal relationship with Jesus.
Otherwise they would be producing the fruit that comes from one who is now living in the Kingdom of God with Jesus.
Everybody who disagrees with me is a Bad Person. Yeah. Thats a powerful argument.
I see quote marks, are you quoting yourself?
You will not ever see me making that statement.
Everybody by nature is a "bad" person needing salvation and the indwelling of Jesus and His Holy Spirit.
The ONLY good in anyone is in Jesus who, for Christians, dwells in us and we in Him.
All glory to God!
As regards the oft-quoted Mt. 16:18
Augustine, sermon:
"Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter's confession. What is Peter's confession? 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' There's the rock for you, there's the foundation, there's where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer. John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine , © 1993 New City Press, Sermons, Vol III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327
Upon this rock, said the Lord, I will build my Church. Upon this confession, upon this that you said, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God,' I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not conquer her (Mt. 16:18). John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 236A.3, p. 48.
Augustine, sermon:
For petra (rock) is not derived from Peter, but Peter from petra; just as Christ is not called so from the Christian, but the Christian from Christ. For on this very account the Lord said, 'On this rock will I build my Church,' because Peter had said, 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.' On this rock, therefore, He said, which thou hast confessed, I will build my Church. For the Rock (Petra) was Christ; and on this foundation was Peter himself built. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Christ Jesus. The Church, therefore, which is founded in Christ received from Him the keys of the kingdom of heaven in the person of Peter, that is to say, the power of binding and loosing sins. For what the Church is essentially in Christ, such representatively is Peter in the rock (petra); and in this representation Christ is to be understood as the Rock, Peter as the Church. Augustine Tractate CXXIV; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers: First Series, Volume VII Tractate CXXIV (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf107.iii.cxxv.html)
Augustine, sermon:
And Peter, one speaking for the rest of them, one for all, said, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God (Mt 16:15-16)...And I tell you: you are Peter; because I am the rock, you are Rocky, Peter-I mean, rock doesn't come from Rocky, but Rocky from rock, just as Christ doesn't come from Christian, but Christian from Christ; and upon this rock I will build my Church (Mt 16:17-18); not upon Peter, or Rocky, which is what you are, but upon the rock which you have confessed. I will build my Church though; I will build you, because in this answer of yours you represent the Church. John Rotelle, O.S.A. Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1993), Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 270.2, p. 289
Augustine, sermon:
Peter had already said to him, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' He had already heard, 'Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona, because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you, that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not conquer her' (Mt 16:16-18)...Christ himself was the rock, while Peter, Rocky, was only named from the rock. That's why the rock rose again, to make Peter solid and strong; because Peter would have perished, if the rock hadn't lived. John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 244.1, p. 95
Augustine, sermon:
...because on this rock, he said, I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not overcome it (Mt. 16:18). Now the rock was Christ (1 Cor. 10:4). Was it Paul that was crucified for you? Hold on to these texts, love these texts, repeat them in a fraternal and peaceful manner. John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1995), Sermons, Volume III/10, Sermon 358.5, p. 193
Augustine, Psalm LXI:
Let us call to mind the Gospel: 'Upon this Rock I will build My Church.' Therefore She crieth from the ends of the earth, whom He hath willed to build upon a Rock. But in order that the Church might be builded upon the Rock, who was made the Rock? Hear Paul saying: 'But the Rock was Christ.' On Him therefore builded we have been. Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1956), Volume VIII, Saint Augustin, Exposition on the Book of Psalms, Psalm LXI.3, p. 249. (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf108.ii.LXI.html)
Augustine, in Retractions,
In a passage in this book, I said about the Apostle Peter: 'On him as on a rock the Church was built.'...But I know that very frequently at a later time, I so explained what the Lord said: 'Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church,' that it be understood as built upon Him whom Peter confessed saying: 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God,' and so Peter, called after this rock, represented the person of the Church which is built upon this rock, and has received 'the keys of the kingdom of heaven.' For, 'Thou art Peter' and not 'Thou art the rock' was said to him. But 'the rock was Christ,' in confessing whom, as also the whole Church confesses, Simon was called Peter. But let the reader decide which of these two opinions is the more probable. The Fathers of the Church (Washington D.C., Catholic University, 1968), Saint Augustine, The Retractations Chapter 20.1:.
Pope Stephen VI (896897), who had his predecessor Pope Formosus exhumed, tried, de-fingered, briefly reburied, and thrown in the Tiber.[1]
Pope John XII (955964), who gave land to a mistress, murdered several people, and was killed by a man who caught him in bed with his wife.
Pope Benedict IX (10321044, 1045, 10471048), who "sold" the Papacy
Pope Boniface VIII (12941303), who is lampooned in Dante's Divine Comedy
Pope Urban VI (13781389), who complained that he did not hear enough screaming when Cardinals who had conspired against him were tortured.[2]
Pope Alexander VI (14921503), a Borgia, who was guilty of nepotism and whose unattended corpse swelled until it could barely fit in a coffin.[3]
Pope Leo X (15131521), a spendthrift member of the Medici family who once spent 1/7 of his predecessors' reserves on a single ceremony[4]
Pope Clement VII (15231534), also a Medici, whose power-politicking with France, Spain, and Germany got Rome sacked.
"The Most Holy Virgin in these last times in which we live has given a new efficacy to the recitation of the Rosary to such an extent that there is no problem,
no matter how difficult it is, wheter temporal or above all spiritual, in the personal life of each one of us, of our families...that cannot be solved by the Rosary.
There is no problem, I tell you, no matter how difficult it is, that we cannot resolve by the prayer of the Holy Rosary."
Sister Lucia dos Santos
The 15 promises
(Given to St. Dominic and Blessed Alan de la Roche)
1 | Whoever shall faithfully serve me by the recitation of the Rosary, shall receive powerful graces. |
2. | I promise my special protection and the greatest graces to all those who shall recite the Rosary. |
3. | The Rosary shall be a powerful armor against hell, it will destroy vice, decrease sin, and defeat heresies |
4. | It will cause virtue and good works to flourish; it will obtain for souls the abundant mercy of God; it will withdraw the hearts of people from the love of the world and its vanities, and will lift them to the desire of eternal things. Oh, that souls would sanctify themselves by this means. |
5. | The soul which recommends itself to me by the recitation of the Rosary, shall not perish. |
6. | Whoever shall recite the Rosary devoutly, applying Himself to the consideration of its Sacred Mysteries shall never be conquered by misfortune. God will not chastise Him in His justice, he shall not perish by an unprovided death; if he be just, he shall remain in the grace of God, and become worthy of eternal life. |
7. | Whoever shall have a true devotion for the Rosary shall not die without the Sacraments of the Church. |
8. | Those who are faithful to recite the Rosary shall have during their life and at their death the light of God and the plentitude of His graces; at the moment of death they shall participate in the merits of the Saints in Paradise. |
9. | I shall deliver from purgatory those who have been devoted to the Rosary. |
10. | The faithful children of the Rosary shall merit a high degree of glory in Heaven. |
11. | You shall obtain all you ask of me by the recitation of the Rosary. |
12. | All those who propagate the Holy Rosary shall be aided by me in their necessities. |
13. | I have obtained from my Divine Son that all the advocates of the Rosary shall have for intercessors the entire celestial court during their life and at the hour of death |
14. | All who recite the Rosary are my children, and brothers and sisters of my only Son, Jesus Christ. |
15. | Devotion of my Rosary is a great sign of predestination. |
The kings of Israel weren't always the kind of people you'd want to hang around with either.
The priests of Israel weren't any better for that matter.
No, what's sad, is that there are people who have no assurance of salvation. I surely do. I don't know about you, because you won't talk about it, but if you don't, that's on you bro.
I must be guilty of the sin of presumption, because I have assurance of salvation. I don't like sin much, but the sin of presumption, is one sin I love to commit. You can have assurance if you want, but if you don't want it, that's on you bro.
So God got it wrong the first time around? I can't imagine that's what you're saying but "which is why" makes it look like that.
Regardless you don't address my point, which is that sinful men have been leading the People of God ever since there WAS a People. You don't bail on God just because the priests and kings have gone bananas. You're taking Him on your terms, not His. We all are prone to this in various ways.
All have sinned and come short of the glory of God ... including Mary the blessed Mother of Jesus. The most pernicious problem in catholic apologetics at FR seems to be conflating the Ekklesia of believers, with the man-made institutional orgs, like catholiciism, methodism, etc.
That is not to say that God is offended by the constructing of orgs, just that these are not THE Church of Jesus. These orgs are to be about the business of bringing people to an awakening that they need a Savior, that Jesus IS that Savior provided by God as God with us, and that the newborns have a collective strength to help one another.
When the org becomes the focus and claims to be the 'one true church' and lays claim to being the ONLY way to salvation, well, FAIL!
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