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To: RnMomof7

Well, that would be all well and good, except that the Church does *not* use those interpolations as evidence for the teachings of the Church, but for other purposes.

I know that some Protestants, for they have told me so, take Christ’s words to His mother at the wedding of Cana to be a put-down of her because He calls her “woman.” They then use this against Catholic teachings about the importance of Mary, the Mother of God, despite the fact that He clearly obeyed her afterwards! This to me is a more egregious example of what you are describing than anything you mention in this article (which is the only one of the two which I have read).

Just remember that there are more kinds of literature in religious writings than the purely literal.


4 posted on 06/11/2015 8:30:10 AM PDT by Chicory
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To: Chicory
but his disagreement with with Cardinal Newman, not with us.
7 posted on 06/11/2015 8:46:34 AM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: Chicory

Mary is the mother of Jesus.

God did not have a mother.

Jesus did.


39 posted on 06/11/2015 12:08:07 PM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: Chicory
Just remember that there are more kinds of literature in religious writings than the purely literal.

I agree 100%. That is why when Jesus said this is my body, He meant it figuratively, not literally. 😎

57 posted on 06/11/2015 1:54:29 PM PDT by Mark17 (Through all my days, and then in Heaven above, my song will silence never, I'll worship Him forever)
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To: Chicory
I know that some Protestants, for they have told me so, take Christ’s words to His mother at the wedding of Cana to be a put-down of her because He calls her “woman.” They then use this against Catholic teachings about the importance of Mary, the Mother of God, despite the fact that He clearly obeyed her afterwards!

You are simply an example of the misuse of Scripture that you condemn, as Jn. 2 is not about the Lord obeying Mary, a there was no command to obey, only an implicit request, which the Lord was free to reject.

And the phrase, "what have I to do with thee" is rather common in Scripture, (2Sam. 16:9; 1Kg. 17:18; 2Kg. 3:13; 2Chr. 35:21; Lk. 4:34; 8:28) and can mean, "what concord have I with you regarding this issue," or "what reason have you for coming to me (or us)." And which affirms the one being petitioned is under no compulsion to grant the request or protests against an action as having no real need.

The response thus calls one to recognize this lack of standing or warrant and perhaps make a case. But having been reminded by the Lord that He answered to a higher authority, and was under no compulsion to perform he request, Mary affirmed this and wisely replied, "Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it."

This humble should give Mary more esteem than if she was presented as one whose requests are like commands to God, as so many Caths profess.

Likewise when faced with the situation in which His mother was standing without desiring to speak with him, the Lord did not do as RCs have Him doing toward the fictional Mary of Catholicism and give her priority and go and see her, but instead to , but

But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother. (Matthew 12:48-50)

Never recorded a women who never sinned, and was a perpetual virgin despite being married (contrary to the normal description of marriage, as in leaving and sexually cleaving) and who would be bodily assumed to Heaven and exalted (officially or with implicit sanction) as

an almost almighty demigoddess to whom "Jesus owes His Precious Blood" to,

whose [Mary] merits we are saved by,

who "had to suffer, as He did, all the consequences of sin,"

and was bodily assumed into Heaven, which is a fact (unsubstantiated in Scripture or even early Tradition) because the Roman church says it is, and "was elevated to a certain affinity with the Heavenly Father,"

and whose power now "is all but unlimited,"

for indeed she "seems to have the same power as God,"

"surpassing in power all the angels and saints in Heaven,"

so that "the Holy Spirit acts only by the Most Blessed Virgin, his Spouse."

and that “sometimes salvation is quicker if we remember Mary's name then if we invoked the name of the Lord Jesus,"

for indeed saints have "but one advocate," and that is Mary, who "alone art truly loving and solicitous for our salvation,"

Moreover, "there is no grace which Mary cannot dispose of as her own, which is not given to her for this purpose,"

and who has "authority over the angels and the blessed in heaven,"

including "assigning to saints the thrones made vacant by the apostate angels,"

whom the good angels "unceasingly call out to," greeting her "countless times each day with 'Hail, Mary,' while prostrating themselves before her, begging her as a favour to honour them with one of her requests,"

and who (obviously) cannot "be honored to excess,"

and who is (obviously) the glory of Catholic people, whose "honor and dignity surpass the whole of creation." Sources and more.

One would have a hard time in Bible times explaining kneeling before a statue and praising the entity it represented in the unseen world, even with adulation, attributes, glory and titles never given in Scripture to created beings (except to false gods), including having the uniquely Divine power glory to hear and respond to virtually infinite numbers of prayers addressed to them, and beseeching such for Heavenly help, and making offerings to them. Which would constitute worship in Scripture, yet Catholics imagine by playing word games they avoid crossing the invisible line between mere "veneration" and worship.

Instead they should do what Mary and every believer in every prayer to Heaven did (and I should do more of), which was to pray directly to the Lord, not secretaries. But they must truly become born again for that.

Moses, put down those rocks! I was only engaging in hyper dulia, not adoring her. Can't you tell the difference?

Instead Caths basically say,

As for the word that thou hast spoken unto us in the name of the Lord, we will not hearken unto thee. But we will certainly do whatsoever thing goeth forth out of our own mouth, to burn incense unto the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her, as we have done, we, and our fathers, our kings, and our princes... (Jeremiah 44:16-17)

96 posted on 06/11/2015 8:26:53 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: Chicory
The word Jesus used is "gunai" [John ii:4], and in the colloquial language of the time was not at all disrepectful. He uses the same word in addressing his mother from the cross [John xix:26].

Before thinking ill of he Holy Family, always go back to the Greek.

119 posted on 06/12/2015 1:16:50 AM PDT by John Locke
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To: Chicory
Christ’s words to His mother at the wedding of Cana...Catholic teachings about the importance of Mary, the Mother of God, despite the fact that He clearly obeyed her afterwards!

Here's the text from the second chapter of John:

3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.

4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.

5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.

First, the Bible calls Mary the mother of Jesus, NOT the mother of God. Jesus has a Mother, God doesn't and that's the Biblical position. Period.

Second, there was no "obeying" of Mary by Jesus.

Scroll up and read the Biblical text.

The Bible is better understood without emotion and with the leading of the Holy Spirit instead being done with Catholic tradition talking points swirling around the brain.

303 posted on 06/13/2015 10:05:59 PM PDT by Syncro (Jesus Christ: The ONLY mediator between God and man)
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To: Chicory

Well this Protestant never saw that “woman” phrase as a put down, nor do most that I know! More of a colloquial use of the word which is familiar and affectionate as I’m given to understand it!


326 posted on 06/15/2015 5:10:27 AM PDT by mdmathis6 (No white, no black,no slave or free,just washed in the red that Messiah bled!)
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