Posted on 11/02/2014 3:14:08 PM PST by NYer
On All Souls Day, the Catholic Church offers prayers and liturgies for the repose of the dead. As Catholics, we are called by the Church to focus our spiritual energies to assist these poor souls, who, though saved, are still in need of purification. Our prayers and sacrifices assist them in this process of purification as a means used by God to communicate purifying grace to them. After all, He is the vine, we are the branches so that He produces his fruits of grace through us.
The practice of praying for the dead actually predates Christianity. In 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45, Judas offers prayers and sacrifices for his fallen comrades to make “atonement for the dead that they might be absolved from their sin.” Some argue that the books of the Maccabees are not inspired scripture. Leaving that argument aside for now, we can at least look at them as historical books detailing accepted pious practices of God’s people some 300 years before Christ.
If that is the only place in the Bible where we find any reference to purgatory, many Protestant Christians argue, then that is a weak support for such a practice. Fortunately, we know as Catholics that all of our doctrines are indeed found in the Word of God, as is the doctrine of Purgatory. Hence what follows is a biblical understanding of the Catholic doctrine of Purgatory.
The book of Genesis recounts for us the far reaching repercussions of Adam and Eve’s disobedience in the Garden. This sin, we find, brought about four consequences which I will summarize here (Gen 3: 16-24):
First, their sin brings about disharmony between persons. God tells Eve that both her relationship to her husband and children will now be characterized by pain and mistrust (Gen 3:16). Further, God has to make garments for man and woman because now, as the text implies, they feel shame (Gen 3:21).
Second, their sin brings about disharmony between man and creation. God tells Adam that he will produce the fruit of the earth with toil and difficulty (Gen 3: 17). Even the ground itself is cursed because of their sin (Gen 3: 17).
Third, their sin brings about disharmony between man and himself. He no longer has spiritual control over his body; thus, his body returns to the dust of the ground (Gen 3: 19). Adam and Eve are no longer able to receive everlasting life (Gen 3: 22).
Lastly and most importantly, sin brings disharmony between God and man. This consequence results in mistrust and fear of God (Gen 3: 10), and, worse, spiritual death. Without God, neither physical nor spiritual life can be sustained (Gen 3: 19, 24).
The first three disharmonies mentioned above are called ‘Temporal punishments due to sin.’ Temporal refers to things pertaining to this world. The last disharmony, the disharmony with God, is called eternal punishment, because it refers to things pertaining to the eternal world with God.
All four of these disharmonies are healed by Christ. The only healing we experience fully in this life, however, is from eternal punishment–or disharmony with God. That’s why Christ is the One Mediator between God and man.
It should be clear that we don’t experience a full healing from the temporal disharmonies/punishments as Christians, because we still struggle. We experience suffering, illness, catastrophes, and even death. Yet, Christ heals these problems, too, it’s just that we don’t experience the full healing in the temporal sphere until He returns.
Until then, we are called to struggle for His Kingdom. As St. Paul puts it, “But we have this treasure (the healing grace of salvation) in earthen vessels, to show that the transcendent power belongs to God and not to us. We are afflicted in every way but not crushed; perplexed, but not driven to despair; persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed; always carrying around in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies.” (2 Cor 7-10)
To overcome these temporal disharmonies, we are called to cooperate with Christ’s power in grace so as to bring about the healing with Him in these areas. This is why we are called to pray, fast, and alms give so as to forgive our neighbor’s sins and be forgiven, and to receive the reward promised by our heavenly Father that we will once again regain temporal peace/harmony on earth and in heaven (Mt 6:5-23).
What happens if we die and are reconciled to God (the eternal punishment for sin), but have not entirely cooperated with grace to overcome the temporal punishments for sin? St. Paul gives us the answer in 1 Cor 3: 12-16. He says that after death, our works will be tested “as though by fire, and the fire will test what kind of work we have done,” and we will suffer loss, though we will still be saved (1 Cor 3:13-15).
This is a very clear passage regarding the purification (which we call purgatory) that takes place after death. This fire purifies us from our temporal disharmonies mentioned above, if we die without having them entirely purified in this life.
I am hoping that having to deal with our “separated brethren” here will earn me at least a partial indulgence.
Honoring the dead with prayers actually goes back to Genesis. And also, when Moses and the whole crew were leaving Egypt they took Joseph’s bones with them. If the dead were not important to them they’d a left him.
You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din.
I AM female, but this quote just had to be verbatum. :o)
Life would be much EASIER not being a Catholic. THINK of all the things we have and do that Protestants don't have to do.
I made a list a while back on all the things that I could think of that Catholics do and have that Protestants don't have. It was a LONG list.
I never knew that they took Joseph's bones back with them.
Catholics can believe whatever they want. But when they come out in public and promote falsehoods, blasphemies, and error they had better understand to have them refuted from scripture. Those who read these threads are going to see the truth as well as the falsehoods of Catholicism.
24 Then Joseph said to his brothers, “I am about to die. But God will surely come to your aid and take you up out of this land to the land he promised on oath to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.” 25 And Joseph made the Israelites swear an oath and said, “God will surely come to your aid, and then you must carry my bones up from this place.”
It was his wish to be buried in the Promised Land.
Rabbi Naftali Brawer:
There is a key argument in the Talmud regarding the length of sentence in Gehinom for sinners and the widely accepted view is that with rare exception the longest sentence does not exceed twelve months. In this sense Gehinom is more like purgatory than eternal damnation.
Source: The Jewish Chronicle Online, August 25, 2011
.
Thank you.
When a prayer from a child rings, the soul from purgatory SINGS.
When a prayer from a child sings, the soul from purgatory WINGS.
But, thanks anyway for the Ka-CHING prayer. Shows that your heart wallet is in the right place. :o)
Judaism is not just Christianity without the Messiah, it is a completely different religion with its own assumptions and conceptualizations.
There WAS a thread about Purgatory in the "Catholic Caucus" recently. This thread, however, was posted as an OPEN Religion Forum topic and had the following assertion:
If that is the only place in the Bible where we find any reference to purgatory, many Protestant Christians argue, then that is a weak support for such a practice. Fortunately, we know as Catholics that all of our doctrines are indeed found in the Word of God, as is the doctrine of Purgatory. Hence what follows is a biblical understanding of the Catholic doctrine of Purgatory.
Should your fellow Freepers who are called "Protestants" not be permitted to respond to such assertions? Should we not be allowed to refute what we see as false doctrine and a perversion of the Gospel of Jesus Christ? Sorry if some RCs get their knickers in a knot whenever someone DARES disagree with them, but that IS the benefit of having this website - we can discuss what we believe with others. If someone is unable to bear reading rebuttals of his faith without seeing "anti-Catholic", "bashing", "criticizing", "mocking" or "deprecation" behind every comment, perhaps the OPEN RF is not where he should go. Bringing such an attitude is seen as disrupting to the thread.
Yes, I do understand that but I hadn't known that Judaism had any thoughts about purgatory. I didn't even know they used that word.
Rabbi Naftali Brawer:
There is a key argument in the Talmud regarding the length of sentence in Gehinom for sinners and the widely accepted view is that with rare exception the longest sentence does not exceed twelve months. In this sense Gehinom is more like purgatory than eternal damnation.
Source: The Jewish Chronicle Online, August 25, 2011
NYer also posted that one, so I'm sure she knows all about the rules of OPEN Religion Forum threads. I'd suggest that if someone doesn't want to read contrary views, he should avoid OPEN threads. However, since THIS one did mention what "Protestants" think on the subject of Purgatory, it's only fair that they be allowed to comment.
I believe that was Tetzel’s sales pitch for the indulgences.
Hindsight is always 20-20, isn’t it?
I tried it for a while and had to come back. The worship was empty and they didn't have the Real Presence.
“...Should we not be allowed to refute what we see as false doctrine...?”
No, because non catholics do not understand catholic theology and always get it wrong. Also - our scriptural proof texts are always ignored by non catholics when cited, even though they are valid and biblical.
Non catholics have no business “refuting” something they do not comprehend.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.