Posted on 03/19/2014 1:32:10 PM PDT by rwa265
that wasn't the question...the question had to do with martyrdom, I merely stated that if you die in defending the christian faith, your own misconduct will be overlooked and you will be saved.
I think the question went back to Pope Urban II's speech regarding promising the remission of sins for those killed in the Crusades.
So you are killed defending the Christian faith, whether you believe in Christ or not, then your misconduct will be "overlooked" and you will be saved??
Please reference the verse(s) in the New Testament that provide for this provision because I don't think I'm familiar with them.
Those who have left the church are doing their best to justify their actions...I understand that mentality...It must have been bad or I would have stayed.....they were wrong and my opinions were right....it is sad to see people grasping at straws to justify actions that they should know were wrong.
why not?? if as you say, Christ's death covered all sin. Therefore, you are obviously not responsible for your actions. I merely maintain that while Christ did indeed die for the sins of mankind, and give us the gift of redemption....we are certainly free to reject His gift and that's exactly what those who continue to willingly commit sins are doing.
Christ's death on the cross covers all sins, past, present and future. Ephesians 2:1 notes that we were dead in our sins and trespasses. The word for trespass includes the following meanings:
3900 paráptōma (from 3895 /parapíptō, see there) – properly, fall away after being close-beside, i.e. a lapse (deviation) from the truth; an error, "slip up"; wrong doing that can be (relatively) unconscious, "non-deliberate."
this encompasses even errant thoughts we might have, even if they are fleeting for a moments time....which we are all going to have. we cannot live sin free no matter how hard we try.
so my question on this is: if you die after thinking one of these fleeting thoughts and you are unable to get to a priest in time to confess/ask for forgiveness, is that sin forgiven based on Christ's death on the cross?
if not, what was the point of His death on the cross?
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. Eph 2:8-9
there is no such thing....a lapsed Catholic...O.K., a former Catholic....can't happen!
I have never met a Catholic who has no protestant friends, family members, associates, etc. We ALL recognize protestants as part of the Christian family....just a little misguided and certainly incomplete.
I have family members who are protestant (Mom's whole family) and I never even suggested, for a moment, that Protestants are outside Gods family, they aren't. However...your beliefs, as a protestant, are slightly in error and certainly incomplete. That puts you outside of nothing at all, just accept the totality of Christianity and you'll be back in the church. I did say be back....if you were legitimatly baptized, you were baptized a Catholic, there is no other possibility. You therefore are a non-practicing Catholic and probably would not have to be rebaptized when you return to Catholicism.
Pope Urban had the authority, from Christ, to forgive sin....Whose sins you shall forgive etc.Pope Urban stated that those who were martyred defendine the faith in the Crusaded would be forgiven their sins and saved....yeah, he could do that. What you bind on eARTH WILL BE BOUND IN hEAVEN....SEE...whoops
To be clear I understand what you are saying on this....Pope Urban II could forgive the sins of a non-believer if they fought in the Crusades and they would be allowed into Heaven?
A person whom you would call a 'lapsed Catholic' who disowns your religion, completely rejects every aspect of it and condemns it as Satanic is still a Catholic in your eyes???
And thus, don't care how the EVIL popes acted; either.
Too bad you'll accept such VILE men in your history without denouncing them; like you apparently LOVE to do with Luther.
do you think that He was kidding when He said whatever you LOOSE on Earth will be LOOSED in Heaven?? What do you suppose that He meant by that???
Did James miss something --- like --- taking one's sins to "priests" to have them "forgiven" only through a [presumed] priesthood?
Therefore confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The active prayer of a righteous person has great power.Here's the [above] same verse, in multiple English language translation.
Feel free to show us the way that Christ instituted which differs.
Relying narrowly upon the passages speaking of sins forgiven or retained (John 20:23), doesn't quite work, for in addition to the explanation at this link not only does Roman Catholic doctrine much negate by total NEGLECT what James wrote in this regard [highlighted in blue text, above] also, it must rely upon a particularly specious distortion which makes the "priesthood" (which there is no direct establishment for using the words "priest" or "priesthood" in the NT, other than as priesthood of believers) into being only those whom the RCC ordains as "priests" can one find propitiation for their sins, thus making Christ Himself a hostage of sorts, according to Romanist theology.
Uh...don't look now mr., but the 'prisoner' has escaped. With RC 'magesterium' even agreeing that be so, when they admit that those far outside of the narrow confines of Roman Catholicism, can indeed perceive the "real presence" of Christ in context of communion -- if those be as the RCC says, "sufficiently devout".
Personally, I don't think my own finding the Spirit of the Lord be present in taking communion be due to my own being devout enough, or in any manner whatsoever reliant upon my own righteousness -- for such can never be enough(!) for the Holt Spirit of God Almighty to be present within a human being, and the deep of the Holy Spirit within, call unto the deep which is the Lord beyond ourselves... with our own selves carried along as it were...not unlike a babe carried by it's own parent.
The sort of eisogesis of scripture which makes RC "priesthood" into sole channel (even chokepoint as it were) of the Lord's own Grace, I do believe, was part of what led Jan Hus to pose the question --"is the priesthood -- the Church?", which if the answer be "yes" that would then leave all others being something of outsiders, or mere supplicants at best, forever in need of this singularly RC defined "priesthood" to dole out the things of God, which sort of thinking would [again] much negate what James had to say, along with the sense we can gain from Paul and Christ both(!) concerning the "renewed man", those born of God, and how we are to interact with one another, in one accord, united in Him. (John 14, Acts 2)
Boldly approach the throne of grace, <---yet as Spurgeon preached (at that link<---), along with other conditions and attitudes he recommended, I ask that you consider particularly those aspects discussed in the first three paragraphs, with Spurgeon later on including "...If in prayer we come to a throne, it is clear that our spirit should, in the first place, be one of lowly reverence."also...
From the 4th Chapter of the Epistle to the Hebrews;
11 May we be diligent, then, to enter into that rest, that no one in the same example of the unbelief may fall,12 for the reckoning of God is living, and working, and sharp above every two-edged sword, and piercing unto the dividing asunder both of soul and spirit, of joints also and marrow, and a discerner of thoughts and intents of the heart;
13 and there is not a created thing not manifest before Him, but all things [are] naked and open to His eyes -- with whom is our reckoning.
14 Having, then, a great chief priest passed through the heavens -- Jesus the Son of God -- may we hold fast the profession,
15 for we have not a chief priest unable to sympathise with our infirmities, but [one] tempted in all things in like manner -- apart from sin;
16 we may come near, then, with freedom, to the throne of the grace, that we may receive kindness, and find grace -- for seasonable help.
Now, all of these things I have brought here, do not preclude or necessarily exclude one confessing their sins to one looked upon within Catholicism as being a "priest", for that process as many have bore witness of, can be both freeing, and valuable too, assisting in bringing ourselves into better accountability with God and one another; yet at the very same time does not demand the same be said only to one bearing title of "priest", unless one accepts also the concept of "priesthood of believers", which would open ourselves to needing be honest and forthright with other Christians in confessing ourselves being sinners, even as to what precisely those sins may be, here again referencing James' "confess your sins one to another that you may be healed" to which also could be added reference to persons openly confessing their sins when undergoing the Baptism of John (the Baptist) for help as to wider context.
My point is you'll excuse their sin; while pouncing all OVER Luther's ALLEGED sin.
THAT is known in the REAL world as HYPOCRACY!
Likewise...
We ALL recognize Catholics as part of the Christian family....just a little over guided and certainly wasting time doing usless rituals.
...point is what, perfection is your expectation???
"Be ye therefore PERFECT...
You guys wrote it!
I appreciate the attempt, anyway. Thanks.
And since the Lord has in spirit, breathed His Spirit upon myself also -- as much as I abide in that same, whatsoever I and others like unto myself in this regard (having the presence of the Holy Ghost within) bind or loose, we do with equal authority.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.