Does the Earth Abide Forever, Like the Bible Says?

March 16, 2014 | PhilipFreneau

[PhilipFreneau]

Does the Earth Abide Forever, Like the Bible Says?

Many Christian doctrines take the following passage literally:

"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea." (Rev 21:1 KJV)

Some even believe there will literally be no seas/oceans in the "new earth!" But there are many other verses that seem to contradict Rev 21:1, as follows:

"One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever." (Eccl 1:4 KJV)

"Bless the Lord, O my soul. O Lord my God ... Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever." (Ps 104:1, 5 KJV)

"For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited …" (Isa 45:18 KJV)

"For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." (John 3:17 KJV)

"I am the living bread which came down from heaven… which I will give for the life of the world." (John 6:51 KJV)

"And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world." (John 12:47 KJV)

"Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen." (Eph 3:21 KJV)

"And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever." (Rev 11:15 KJV)

When considering all that, it does seem likely that Revelation 21:1 has been misinterpreted. Similar verses to 21:1 can be found in Isaiah:

"And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen: for the Lord God shall slay thee, and call his servants by another name: That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes. For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind." (Isa 65:15-19 KJV)

That context continues into the next chapter, where we find this:

"For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord. And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me …" (Isa 66:22-24 KJV)

My first question on that passage would be, "where did all those dead people come from? Isn't this supposed to be a new earth?"

Digging deeper, I find similar inconsistencies in the New Jerusalem references of the "new earth" in Revelation 21 and 22, as follows:

"And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it." (Rev 21:24 KJV)

"In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations." (Rev 22:2 KJV)

So, in the "new earth" we find nations and we find kings? Where did they come from? And some or all of the nations even require healing?

Nothing seems to fit a literal new-heaven, new-earth scenario. It seems more likely that the new heaven and new earth terms are symbolic for a major spiritual change, or something similar. Peter offers this:

"Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness." (2 Pet 3:13 KJV)

Now, if God sent his Son to save the world, what better way to save it than changing the spirituality of the inhabitants from evil to righteous?

After examining all this evidence, I have no alternative but to conclude that this earth abideth forever, like the Preacher, the Son of David, has declared in Ecclesiastes 1:4.

Philip

[Ghost of SVR4]

Only two ways to look at it; the bible has an expiration date or the earth does (which means; kind of, the bible does). The Sun won’t wait around forever as it expands.

[Jonty30]

Yeah, unless the gravitational pull of the sun eventually sucks the earth in, there’s not really much in the universe that can destroy the earth. So, I can probably give a reasonable guarantee the Earth could be around forever.

However, can I guarantee that life on Earth will be around forever?

Not so much.

[Jack Hydrazine]

Until the Death Star shows up!

[SubMareener]

The only significant question is “Is you name written in the Book of Life?” If it is not, then your future is inside the Eternal Lake of Fire.

[Hootowl]

IIRC, He says in Revelations, “Behold, I make all things new,” not all new things. I think that means He’s going to restore the old earth as it was in beginning and will be ever after, world without end, amen.

[Lee N. Field]

For they deliberately overlook this fact, that the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed out of water and through water by the word of God, and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly. (2 Peter 3:5-7 ESV)

Fire next time.

[Patriot Babe]

The Earth will purify itself thru fire. Remember God promised no floods and that Rainbow was a symbol of his promise except a certain group stole that symbol but God shall reclaim it. Any the Earth shall always be, except after the 1000 year reign of God’s kingdom here on Earth. The Earth will purify itself and will be perfect.

[jimmyray]

You've got problems with your eschatology, for a text, taken out of context, is a pretext.

Rev 21:1 Then I saw "a new heaven and a new earth,”a for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.
4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’b or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”
5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”

We can draw several things from this passage, that contradict your last vanity post regarding the millenium, and this post.

1. There will be a new heavens and a new earth
2. The old heavens and earth will pass away
3. New Jerusalem comes to earth, and God and the Lamb will dwell there, with his people, on earth
4. There will be no more death, crying, mourning or pain
5. He is making EVERYTHING new
6.The emphasis is made that "...these words are trustworthy and true".

I would not contradict these plain words.

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>Only two ways to look at it; the bible has an expiration date or the earth does (which means; kind of, the bible does). The Sun won’t wait around forever as it expands.<<<

Says who, Carl Sagan? God may have something to say about that.

Philip

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>However, can I guarantee that life on Earth will be around forever? Not so much.<<<

If you believe Ecclesiastes 1:4, John 3:17, and Revelation 22:2, you should have every reason to believe that life will be on this planet, forever. And not just life, but human life.

Philip

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>IIRC, He says in Revelations, “Behold, I make all things new,” not all new things. I think that means He’s going to restore the old earth as it was in beginning and will be ever after, world without end, amen.<<<

You know, I forgot all about that verse. That is what I believe. Thanks.

“And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.” (Rev 21:5)

Philip

[jimmyray]

Regarding Isaiah 66, we have to keep the words in context:

22 “As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me,” declares the Lord, “so will your name and descendants endure.
23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me,” says the Lord.
24 “And they will go out and look on the dead bodies of those who rebelled against me; the worms that eat them will not die, the fire that burns them will not be quenched, and they will be loathsome to all mankind.”

Verse 22 does not indicate a chronology, insisting that the events of 23 and 24 follow the new heaven and new earth of verse 22.

Rather, God is making a comparison that the endurance of Israel's name will be forever, just as the new heavens and earth will endure forever.

Note He does not say the current heavens and earth endure forever, rather, the new!

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>Fire next time.<<<

Jesus baptized with fire:

"John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:" (Luke 3:16 KJV)

Peter explained:

"That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:" (1 Pet 1:7 KJV)

Philip

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>Note He does not say the current heavens and earth endure forever, rather, the new!<<<

"One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever." (Eccl 1:4 KJV)

I see nothing about a new earth in that statement. Nor in this one:

"Bless the Lord, O my soul. O Lord my God ... Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever." (Ps 104:1, 5 KJV)

Nor this one:

"For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited …" (Isa 45:18 KJV)

Nor this one:

"And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever." (Rev 11:15 KJV)

Philip

[Lee N. Field]

Peter likens what will come to the Flood. And, he regards the Flood as the great dividing line in history, between "the world that then was" and "the world that now is".

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn! But according to his promise we are waiting for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. (2 Peter 3:10-13 ESV)

It really doesn't sound like we just tick away, generation after generation, on into the future.

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>The Earth will purify itself thru fire. Remember God promised no floods and that Rainbow was a symbol of his promise except a certain group stole that symbol but God shall reclaim it. Any the Earth shall always be, except after the 1000 year reign of God’s kingdom here on Earth. The Earth will purify itself and will be perfect.<<<

I personally believe the 1000 year reign is over, and Satan has been loosed out of his prison. Regarding fire, I posted a response to that in #14, but I will post again for you:

Jesus baptized with fire:

"John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose:he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:" (Luke 3:16 KJV)

Peter explained:

"That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:" (1 Pet 1:7 KJV)

My implication was that the earth would be made spiritually new.

Philip

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>I would not contradict these plain words.<<<

I posted line after line of “contradictionary” (if you must) scripture, even from the Revelation chapters 21 and 22! But it is only “contradictory” if one interprets the Bible the way you interpret it.

Are you implying the Bible contradicts itself? Did you read my entire post?

Philip

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>”...But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly. (2 Peter 3:5-7 ESV)”<<<

By the way, I forgot to mention that I believe Peter was referring to the 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem and Israel, and of Judaism as a viable religion.

Philip

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>The only significant question is “Is you name written in the Book of Life?” If it is not, then your future is inside the Eternal Lake of Fire.<<<

Amen!