Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: boatbums; All
Perhaps it is because we recognize that Jesus IS the promised Messiah?

Yes, but how do you know he was? "Recognition" can be very subjective. How do you know beyond the shadow of a doubt without merely accepting the "new testament" at face value from the beginning?

We can look at the three HUNDRED plus prophecies given in the Hebrew Bible and discover that they were fulfilled by the historical Jesus

Correction: these prophecies were fulfilled according to the "new testament." But how do you know the "new testament" has the true and authentic interpretation of the messianic prophecies? THIS is what none of you chrstians ever explain.

(with the exception of those few future ones yet to be).

Until radical evengelical Protestantism those "future prophecies" were considered fulfilled "spiritually" in the church. So there's one departure from classical chrstianity already. What's the reason for not departing all the way?

Do you actually think that Christians just invented their religion based upon nothing? Jesus of Nazareth was a REAL person, he rose from the dead after his brutal crucifixion - witnessed by hundreds of people, he performed miracles

But none of this proves he was the messiah. It only "proves" it if you accept from the outset that chrstianity and the "new testament" (and their interpretation of the Hebrew Bible) is true.

I don't suppose you've ever read the thirteenth chapter of Deuteronomy?

and his teachings were based on the SPIRIT of the Law of Moses and the purpose of the Almighty in the affairs of His creation.

Once again, you are merely parroting the chrstian claims. You aren't proving them by the Word of G-d as already given to Israel. Does it take an "addition" to the Bible (a la the "book of mormon") to justify chrstianity? If so, then it's a false religion!

Furthermore your concept of "the 'spirit' of the Law" is very anti-Torah and liberal. Liberals have always attacked the literal commandments of the Torah in favor of a more "spiritual" interpretation. And even here you continue to simply repeat chrstian claims. Repeating chrstian claims proves nothing. Israel was not given the "new testament" at Sinai. It was given the Torah. And it is only the Torah that can justify chrstian claims, not writings produced by chrstians themselves based on their own assumptions.

You also commit the cardinal chrstian sin of not understanding that the Torah is not temporary or chr*stological but the reason the universe was created. The Prophets are on a lesser level than the Torah, not a greater one. All authentic prophets are completely subject to the Torah. Any prophet who claims it will be replaced by something else (or "be fulfilled" as chrstians dishonestly put it) is false.

Not everyone will believe and receive this truth - that was also foretold - and Jesus would be rejected by His own people - another one of those prophecies. But one day every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.

And once again, just more of the same.

You can't prove chrstianity by merely parroting its claims--unless you take the TaNa"KH out of christian "bibles" and stop claiming your religion fulfills it. If chrstianity fulfills the Torah (G-d forbid!!!) then the Torah will say so. Prove what you say by the Torah itself or stop making your claims.

81 posted on 02/25/2014 8:03:17 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator (The Left: speaking power to truth since Shevirat HaKelim.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 69 | View Replies ]


To: Zionist Conspirator
Correction: these prophecies were fulfilled according to the "new testament." But how do you know the "new testament" has the true and authentic interpretation of the messianic prophecies? THIS is what none of you chrstians ever explain.

There are enough prophecies in the Old Testament about Jesus that have come true that the odds of Jesus not being who the NT claims he is is a statistically impossible...

You can't prove chrstianity by merely parroting its claims--

We don't set out to prove anything...

I can only cite my personal situation...Other may have experienced the same...

I was desperate...Things had fallen apart...I can't say that I considered suicide as an option but I can see where some people might in that situation...

I didn't know anything about the grace that God has offered all men but looking back, that is what led me to call out to God...'God help me'...

I didn't have any faith...I guess I had desperate hope...God didn't answer me immediately...Although I experienced some sort of peace...

A couple of nights later, I was out wandering in my truck and when I came up on a sign that said Church, my truck veered into the parking lot...I walked and shortly after was introduced to Jesus...

It was Jesus who gave me faith...No need for proof...

And interestingly, the few months prior to my crash, I was drawn to the bible...I'd pick it up and try to read it and it made no real sense to me...And now it makes more sense than anything else I've ever read...

1Co 1:22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
1Co 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
1Co 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
1Co 1:25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

unless you take the TaNa"KH out of christian "bibles" and stop claiming your religion fulfills it. If chrstianity fulfills the Torah (G-d forbid!!!) then the Torah will say so.

No...There is no prophecy of Christianity in the Old Testament...The prophecy in the Old Testament is the coming Messiah who suffered, and then the Kingdom with the King on the Throne of David...The 'church' which is in between those two was kept a secret...A mystery...

Rom 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
Rom 16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Eph 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
Eph 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Eph 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
Eph 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
Eph 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

Don't know if that gives any insight to your question, hopefully it does...

88 posted on 02/25/2014 10:06:49 AM PST by Iscool (Ya mess with me, you mess with the WHOLE trailer park...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies ]

To: Zionist Conspirator
But how do you know the "new testament" has the true and authentic interpretation of the messianic prophecies? THIS is what none of you chrstians ever explain.

We owe the New Testament (NT) revelation to Jews such as the twelve apostles and Paul, what makes you think you know more than the Jews who gave us the NT?

Moreover, you are not even a Jew, for heavens sakes, you are but a Gentile from Tennessee claiming your are a Jew, you are but a so called "Noahide."

What makes you think you are the last word on the Jewish written NT, coming on this Christian forum thinking your anti-Christianism is the last word on the NT?

What makes you think you know more than the Jews who gave us the NT? Who lived two thousand years closer to the Jewish-Christian milieu that gave us the NT, than you?

Are you that conceited that you actually think yourself superior to these other Jews (the apostles and Paul)?

93 posted on 02/25/2014 2:24:29 PM PST by sasportas
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies ]

To: Zionist Conspirator
Let me ask you this....both Jews and Noahides/Noahites believe that the Messiah will one come one day, do they not? How will they/you recognize him when he does? What will set him apart from all the other pretenders and posers that have always been around? How will you KNOW he is the true Messiah?
104 posted on 02/25/2014 11:01:46 PM PST by boatbums (Simul justis et peccator)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson