“I don’t think you understand that the Worldwide Church of God and United Church of God are different churches and different organizations. Herbert Armstrong was dead for almost a decade before UCG started. They are different legally, in their government structure and philosophically.”
From the UCG website, an article titled “A Forgotten Hero: Herbert W. Armstrong”
“[Herbert Armstrong] came to understand that the Creator, God Almighty, exists and rules the universe. He discovered many proofs of the inspiration and authenticity of the Bible. In addition, the cause of all the world’s ills, as well as the solution that will come, were brought to light.
The missing dimension in knowledge came alive: What man is, why man was put on the earth, the purpose for which we were made. He also came to understand the way to peace, happiness and abundance. It all made sense! Here were revealed the answers—which neither science, education, government or religion had—to humanity’s troubles. The very gospel brought to the world by Jesus Christ had largely been rejected or ignored for 18 1/2 centuries.”
http://www.ucg.org/news/forgotten-hero-herbert-w-armstrong-1892-1986/
From Walter Martin’s book on the topic:
“Most of the splinter cults of Armstrongism retain the name ‘Church of God’ somewhere in their title. They mix legalism, including strict Sabbatarianism, with a variety of Armstrong’s leading doctrines. Two other noteworthy groups among these are the Global Church of God, located in San Diego, California, and the United Church of God in Arcadia, California. The former has a television following on two superstations covering much of the United States, while the latter publishes The Good News magazine and covers thirty television stations with programming.” (Walter Martin, The Kingdom of the Cults, Ed. Hank Hanegraaff. Pg. 472)
The UCG in question here split in 95, when the Worldwide Church of God reformed and returned to Trinitarianism and rejected Armstrong’s teachings. Though, there’s like a hundred more offshoot groups out there, each one thinking they’re the true church of God on Earth. And the UCG itself has already spawned another offshoot, due to a dispute over abuse of control issues by their authorities.
“I’m not “bound”. I observe them from love, gratitude, and for the spiritual help and blessing they are.”
The UCG does in fact teach that its members are bound to them, calling them “Christian obligations” and the “Christian way of life,” that no true Christian “neglects” without risk. The quote I provided even called them “commanded,” not optional, or simply you choosing to follow Jewish dietary laws and feast days because you can.
It is the way the UCG differentiates between themselves and the alleged fakers:
“Millions of people claim to be Christian—followers of Jesus Christ. Yet their beliefs, practices and lifestyles differ greatly. Jesus said His true followers are “called, chosen and faithful.” How can we discern who His true disciples are?”
Salvation, according to the UCG, is through a “conversion’ process, and not all those who claim to be Christian, according to them, are actually Christian. They have wrong “religious beliefs” and “assumptions”:
“His warning [Christ’s warning, see link] should cause all of us to carefully consider our religious beliefs and assumptions. Why? Because many who claim to be His followers, who claim to have done great deeds in His name, will be rejected by Him. He will tell them, “I never knew you” (verse 23). How, then, can we distinguish the authentic disciples of Christ, who really are doing the will of the Father, from those who call Jesus “Lord” but neglect or refuse to do God’s will?”
http://www.ucg.org/booklet/transforming-your-life-process-conversion/who-are-gods-true-followers/
From the article titled “Is the laying on of hands necessary to receive the Holy Spirit?”
“The Bible gives us a clear answer. Paul came upon some believers in Ephesus who had been baptized by no less than John the Baptist. Yet they had not received the Holy Spirit for two reasons. One is that they did not have the laying on of hands. The other was that they apparently did not fully understand the Christian way of life, the covenant into which one enters through baptism.”
Note, the “Christian way of life”. Until John’s disciples could be indoctrinated into still maintaining the Mosaic dietary and feast days, and in living in obedience to the alleged UCG of the 1st century, they could not be saved. It goes on:
“What did their baptism by John accomplish? Undoubtedly, it helped prepare them for conversion, for he preached repentance. And it likely strengthened their resolve to obey God. But the baptism didn’t bring about their conversion or result in their receiving the Holy Spirit. Clearly, many factors have to be in order for that to take place, including knowledge of sin (the transgression of God’s law, 1 John 3:4), an awareness of the need for forgiveness, true repentance (turning from sin to obedience) and a clear understanding of the obligations of Christianity. In addition, the baptism should, under normal circumstances, be done by a minister of God’s true Church, followed by the laying on of hands and prayer to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.”
Note that these are “obligations”, and that this, under “normal circumstances,” should be done by a “minister of God’s true church” UCG Inc., “followed by the laying on of hands” to receive the Holy Spirit.
http://www.ucg.org/bible-faq/laying-hands-necessary-receive-holy-spirit
“This is 100% completely not true and not what UCG teaches nor is this what the vast majority of members of UCG believe in my experience.”
This is true, as seen in the links above.
I'm not sure how quoting an opinion piece from someone who used to be in Worldwide and is now in UCG is relevant to my statement. The article you linked to clearly says:
"At New York City’s Family Christian Club July 31, 2004, the speakers were assigned to speak on a forgotten hero. The author chose Herbert W. Armstrong, who was born on that day, and who died 20 years ago this month."
My statement was:
“I don’t think you understand that the Worldwide Church of God and United Church of God are different churches and different organizations. Herbert Armstrong was dead for almost a decade before UCG started. They are different legally, in their government structure and philosophically."
You quote someone who wrote and spoke about Herbert Armstrong. You will find a lot of people in UCG have opinions about Herbert Armstrong or the WorldWide Church of God. Big deal. You didn't refute or can't refute my initial statement so it still stands.
The UCG does in fact teach that its members are bound to them, calling them “Christian obligations” and the “Christian way of life,” that no true Christian “neglects” without risk. The quote I provided even called them “commanded,” not optional, or simply you choosing to follow Jewish dietary laws and feast days because you can.
Again you discounted my statement to basically make up your own statement about what I believe. As far as I know there's only one other person in my head besides me and that's Jesus Christ. :-)
There is a distinction between obedience springing from love as opposed to being forced to believe something from intimidation and fear. I believe the Lord does "command" his followers to follow his way of life and his way to happiness....the bible is his instruction book for us. That's only weird if one isn't used to looking at the bible to live a Godly life.
This is true, as seen in the links above.
Let me remind you, and the readers, that this was the exchange:
GPH: "IOW, if you are not baptized and have hands laid on you by the UCG, you are not in “God’s Family.”"
Me: “This is 100% completely not true and not what UCG teaches nor is this what the vast majority of members of UCG believe in my experience.”
Your statement is still 100% NOT true. It's false. UCG does not teach or suggest what you say. Even IF they did, which they don't, it's not what I believe.
What you did was to string together somethings and then make an assertion. Assertions are not truth.
bttt
LOL so much for “ecumenical.”
All the usual suspects came on board on cue.
All we need is that fractal gif.