Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Greetings_Puny_Humans
“If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake. But if any man say unto you, This is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord’s, and the fulness thereof: Conscience, I say, not thine own, but of the other: for why is my liberty judged of another man’s conscience? For if I by grace be a partaker, why am I evil spoken of for that for which I give thanks? Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.” (1Co 10:27-31)

Paul is addressing the issue of whether or not Christians should eat otherwise clean meat that had been sacrificed to idols and then later sold in the meat market. Was it acceptable? Paul left it up to the conscience of the person. He addresses this same topic a number of times in his letters. The fact that you're not aware of it is understandable.

Says the guy who thinks he’s going to become a God of his own planet after he dies: “By a resurrection, we become born God personages — personages just as our God the Father and Christ the Son! We shall have the entire universe put beneath our feet (Hebrews 2:8).” (Herbert Armstrong, The Plain Truth (September 1980): 40)M

You do know Herbert Armstrong has been dead for almost 30 years and was dead for almost a decade before United was formed...right?

As for feast days: “One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.” (Rom 14:5-6),

You really should look more at what the words say rather then putting just accepting the traditional spin on it. Romans 14 is about food, not holy days. The verse you quoted does not mention the holy days of the Lord, which in scripture are always called by the term "heorte" (transliterated from greek). For example:

1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast (heortazo), not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

In other words, Paul tells his congregation, a congregation composed of gentile and jewish Christians....to keep the feast of the Lord. That is the only meaning of heortazo. But neither heortazo nor heorte is found in romans 14.

Since Paul absolutely affirms that he and his congregations were keeping the feast days of the Lord Jesus Christ you really should re-think your interpretation of Roman 14:5,6.

Actually, Uzziel is a famous Rabbi (though the Jews of today do not read him) from before the time of Christ by about 30 years. He was a believer, unlike you.

Unlike me he couldn't have believed in Christ since he was from before the time of Christ.

Look, it's no shame to admit that you believe what you believe because you pick tradition over Christ and scripture. It is what it is.

What happened was that in the first century Judea revolted against the Roman empire three times. Because of this Jewish hatred was rampant in the Roman empire. Anything or anybody that even "looked" Jewish was persecuted and demeaned. As a result some early Christians began to distance themselves from the biblical teachings of Christ and invented their own stories of why these things didn't apply to them. They substituted man made holidays for biblical holy days. They gladly starting eating pork and other foods prohibited by the Lord to "prove" they weren't Jewish. As a result there was an entire branch of Christianity descended from those who couldn't take the heat of persecution for their beliefs and so decided to save their own skins by foregoing the commandments of the Lord Jesus Christ.

105 posted on 12/27/2013 5:50:47 PM PST by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 104 | View Replies ]


To: DouglasKC

106 posted on 12/27/2013 5:51:29 PM PST by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 105 | View Replies ]

To: DouglasKC

“Paul is addressing the issue of whether or not Christians should eat otherwise clean meat”


Actually, ALL meat is clean, whether it is sold in shambles or not, or offered to idols or not. The only cause of offense can be in confirming another in their idolatry, as Paul is quite clear “for their conscience” sake, and not our own:

Rom 14:14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
Rom 14:15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.
Rom 14:16 Let not then your good be evil spoken of:

Again, all things are lawful to me, though not all are expedient:

1Co 10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.

We are no longer under law, but under grace, and thus, we are under no obligation to follow any dietary laws. Our only fear, then, is in offending others, since “all meat is pure,” but we ought not destroy another through it, such as in confirming them in their idolatry, or causing them to offend:

1Co 8:8 But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.

This is the Gospel of grace. Not surprising that you would be absolutely ignorant of it.

“You do know Herbert Armstrong has been dead for almost 30 years and was dead for almost a decade before United was formed...right?”


Your website teaches his doctrines on the ‘God family’, and even calls him a “forgotten hero”:

http://www.ucg.org/news/forgotten-hero-herbert-w-armstrong-1892-1986/

I wonder if the UCB teaches against Lying or not.

” Romans 14 is about food, not holy days.”


Romans 14 is a twofer against your religion. It is both against your absurd dietary laws, as well as days, as it says specifically “one man esteemeth one day above another, another esteemeth every day the same. Let each one be fully persuaded in his own mind.”

“In other words, Paul tells his congregation, a congregation composed of gentile and jewish Christians....to keep the feast of the Lord. That is the only meaning of heortazo. But neither heortazo nor heorte is found in romans 14.”


I do believe the UCB does not teach against lying. Notice that you managed to turn the singular word “feast” into “feasts,” without flinching. Furthermore, that feast is identified as Christ our passover, not your feasts, which have already been fulfilled in Him, from the verse you ommitted:

“Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.” (1Co 5:7-8)

Neither can sincerity or truth actually be eaten.

That said, the only “feast” we are to keep is the Lord’s Supper, which is specifically commanded to us:

Luk 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

No other command aside from the Lord’s Supper is given to us, and so no other command do we need regard. Furthermore, the feast of the Lord’s Supper was not tied to any particular day. Christians of old practiced it everyday:

“I promised you [new Christians], who have now been baptized, a sermon in which I would explain the sacrament of the Lord’s Table, which you now look upon and of which you last night were made participants. You ought to know that you have received, what you are going to receive, and what you ought to receive daily. That bread which you see on the altar, having been sanctified by the word of God, is the Body of Christ. That chalice, or rather, what is in that chalice, having been sanctified by the word of God, is the Blood of Christ” (Augustine, Sermons 227 [A.D. 411]).

“Unlike me he couldn’t have believed in Christ since he was from before the time of Christ.”


All the better, since he’s a Jew who confirms what has been taught by Christians for 2,000 years.

” As a result some early Christians began to distance themselves from the biblical teachings of Christ and invented their own stories of why these things didn’t apply to them.”


The only people who might agree with you would be the Gnostics from the second century, but they denied the Old Testament and considered the God of the Old Testament as the evil demiurge. However, they were polytheists, and they also did not celebrate the Lord’s Supper. Up next would be the Arians from the 4th century, but they didn’t teach your “God Family” stuff.

The only “feast” we see practiced by Christians is the Lord’s Supper:

From Ignatius who perished between 95-115AD:

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes” (Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1 [A.D. 110]).

Let’s face it, neither history nor scripture agrees with you.


107 posted on 12/27/2013 6:29:15 PM PST by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 105 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson