Joel Osteen Rebukes Apostles Paul, Peter, and John

United for Awakening ^ | 8/27/13 | Peter Michael Martinez

[Kritter0412]

This was not to say who is perfect or who is not, but when a person decides that taking the Word out of the Word is indeed correct, then it is time for him to examine their lives and get right w/ God. No one is perfect, but as Christians, we are called to be like Jesus..Christ like to be exact. We are also called to reach out to people and bring as many to God as we can.

[TBP]

False? Not at all.

[TBP]

theology credentials mean nothing to me.

IOW, you know more about it than people who have devoted their lives to studying it? There is no credible evidence to support your position. It is simply a statement of blind faith. We know for a fact that there have been significant alterations, as well as scribal errors. We also know factually and conclusively that much of what was written is pseudepigraphic. The history of it is questionable, at best. But it isn't a work of history -- it's a work of inspiration, moral philosophy, and theology. It's more poetry than history. Nothing wrong with that. Your theologians are simply ignoring this evidence.

[.45 Long Colt]

I wish I had time to write a detailed response because it’s too important a topic to ignore. For now all I will say is that Osteen’s gospel isn’t the gospel. He tempts people to pursue all the things of the world lost people already want in their flesh. What he and his ilk do is an abomination, utter wickedness.

1 John 2:15-16

Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

[Sopater]

There is no credible evidence to support your position. It is simply a statement of blind faith.

Evidently, I share my "blind faith" in the absense of credible evidence with many true biblical scholars such as:

• Luke Timothy Johnson, the Robert W. Woodruff Professor of New Testament and Christian Origins at Candler School of Theology and a Senior Fellow at the Center for the Study of Law and Religion at Emory University
• William Lane Craig, who said that Of the 74 [scholars] listed in their publication The Five Gospels, only 14 would be leading figures in the field of New Testament studies. More than half are basically unknowns, who have published only two or three articles. Eighteen of the fellows have published nothing at all in New Testament studies. Most have relatively undistinguished academic positions, for example, teaching at a community college.
• Gregory A. "Greg" Boyd, one of the 20 most influential Christian scholars of 2010, said that "The Jesus Seminar represents an extremely small number of radical-fringe scholars who are on the far, far left wing of New Testament thinking. It does not represent mainstream scholarship."
• Dale Allison, American New Testament scholar, historian of Early Christianity, and Christian theologian who currently serves as Errett M. Grable Professor of New Testament Exegesis and Early Christianity at Pittsburgh Theological Seminary. Recently appointed the Richard J. Dearborn Professor of New Testament Studies at Princeton Theological Seminary.
• John Ankerberg and John Weldon also comment on the Jesus Seminar:
  • "...it is the conservative view of Scripture that 'passes the rigorous tests of the rule of evidence' - not their historical distortions." bullet "The JS distortions are being disseminated everywhere."
  • "...the JS does not represent a consensus of New Testament (NT) or biblical scholarship..."
  • "...the biases of members of the JS are clearly present in their writings."
  • "...it fails to recognize the serious or fatal philosophical and methodological flaws that undermine its own conclusions."
• Robert J. Hutchison commented: "...the scholarship that undergirds the Jesus Seminar and similar enterprises is based on wild speculation and miniscule evidence."

There are also countless books written by conservative Christians that outline the massive amounts of evidence for the authority of the gospels inculding the link I provided to the Fundamentals of the Christian Faith that thoroughly dismantles "higher criticism"... so to call my adherance to the authority of the gospels "blind faith" is a straw-man argument that is only intended to influence the uninformed... a typical liberal strategy that fails to work on those who have done some homework.

[.45 Long Colt]

By Providence, today’s “Renewing Your Mind” broadcast is

“Becoming a Better You”

The alternative gospel of Joel Osteen and prosperity preachers forgoes the cross and advises us to merely “do our best.” At its heart, this is pure legalism of the worst variety. John MacArthur examines the alternative gospel of these preachers and explains why legalism-lite is still legalism.

From the series: Christless Christianity: 2010 West Coast Conference

http://www.ligonier.org/rym/broadcasts/video/becoming-better-you1/

Here is a short clip of John MacArthur on Osteen:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDuDN2FtrIo

[Hot Tabasco]

Tough call on Osteen but I view him as nothing more than a multi-millionaire motivational speaker.........

Would I attend a Sunday "seminar"? nope.........

[TBP]

Joel Osteen and others tell you to “live your best life”, which is very similar to “becoming a better you.”

One is not an authority merely because you agree with him.

[TBP]

“Radical fringe”? Ridiculous. These are well-respected, well-established scholars. (What that tells me is that Mr. Boyd can’t refute them, so he needs to try to marginalize them.)

These are scholars with many books, classes, much research, and many of whom have examined actual manuscripts. They’re in an excellent position to know what they’re talking about. They use the rules of evidence in support of what they say. Your scholars don’t seem to be doing that.

There is little evidence to support what you call “the authority of the gospels.” It’s based on nothing but faith.

[Sopater]

Mr. Boyd can’t refute them, so he needs to try to marginalize them.

Mr. Boyd refutes them here, and again, he is not alone.

There is little evidence to support what you call “the authority of the gospels.”

There is plenty of evidence. Some, who hope that there is some other way to obtain Salvation besides faith in Jesus, as He is recorded in the Bible, choose to ignore it. That's nothing new.

[.45 Long Colt]

So you defend his heresies?

[JRios1968]

The pastor of the church we attended in Florida would call folks like Joel Osteen the “Easy Life Pastors”...he didn’t mean it in a complimentary manner, either.

[dfwgator]

Joel Osteen Rebukes Apostles Paul, Peter, and John

He left out George and Ringo.

[Sopater]

We call them “limp-wristed”.

[smvoice]

Give him time. He’s working his way through the big ones right now. Wait ‘til he finds out Led isn’t a person.

[Onetwofree]

This is a misrepresentation of Osteen.

It is very unlikely that Osteen takes a “universalist” stand as claimed by the author. Osteen might say that all people sin; that regardless of the “badness” of the sin or a person’s past, anyone can come to God through Jesus Christ and be forgiven for their sin, even homosexuals. And, that he prefers an approach that emphasizes the love of God, not one that lambasts people for their sinfulness, etc.

The scriptures quoted are accurate; the assumptions attributed to Osteen are not. Making up fallacious arguments, attributing the arguments to Osteen, then attacking the fallacious arguments = poor logic, poor journalism. Unfortunate.

[Alex Murphy]

This is a misrepresentation of Osteen. It is very unlikely that Osteen takes a “universalist” stand as claimed by the author. Osteen might say that all people sin; that regardless of the “badness” of the sin or a person’s past, anyone can come to God through Jesus Christ and be forgiven for their sin, even homosexuals. And, that he prefers an approach that emphasizes the love of God, not one that lambasts people for their sinfulness, etc.

Unlikely, but not inaccurate:

LARRY KING: If you believe you have to believe in Christ? They're wrong, aren't they?
JOEL OSTEEN: Well, I don't know if I believe they're wrong. I believe here's what the Bible teaches and from the Christian faith this is what I believe. But I just think that only God with judge a person's heart. I spent a lot of time in India with my father. I don't know all about their religion. But I know they love God. And I don't know. I've seen their sincerity. So I don't know. I know for me, and what the Bible teaches, I want to have a relationship with Jesus.
-- Larry King Live, June 20, 2005

See also:
Does Joel Osteen Not Know, or Does He Not Care? [On Mormonism]
Joel Osteen and Why Theology Matters, Again
For Joel Osteen, Theology is Optional
Joel Osteen and “Joel-Likeness”
Faith & The Gospel [Michael Horton Takes On Osteen With Link To 60 Minutes Clip of Horton)

Oh, and welcome to FR!

Onetwofree
Since Sep 23, 2013

[Oguazi]

I have read this article carefully and listened to some controversial interviews of Pastor Joel Osteen, but did not see where he rebuked Apostles Paul, Peter and John. I acknowledge that Pastor Osteen has had some doctrinal errors in his presentations in television interviews that are inexcusable; however, I do not support such write up against him that is hateful and destructive. The caption of this article is provocative and is purely the product of the imaginative thoughts of the writer. I have listened to Pastor Osteen minister on several occasions and have been blessed by his ministry. I know that there are several hundred of others that have been encouraged, comforted, restored and refreshed by his ministry worldwide. However, I do not agree with some statements he has made on some TV interviews. He came back to retrieve some of them, but he did not retrieve some of the recent statements. Some of them were shocking to me, but my first response was not to condemn him, but pray for him. I also believe that those Christian leaders who have access to him should correct him and probably rebuke him too; but no one should attempt to destroy him or his ministry. Trying to do that or incite people against him will be doing more harm to the Body of Christ than the wrong the Pastor did in the first place. Most of us are not perfect. Someone can miss it; but it is for those who know better to correct or rebuke him with the spirit of love. Even Apostle Peter missed it by distancing himself from Gentile Christians in Antioch when Believers from Jerusalem visited, and Apostle Paul had to rebuke him (Galatians 2:11-14). He did not do it to destroy him, but to correct him. Their love for one another was not lost because of that experience and that was why Peter had beautiful things later to say about the ministry of Paul (2 Peter 3:15). I believe that we should be careful when we notice that fellow Believers are missing the way. We should do our best to correct them and lead them back to the way and not destroy them. Those who feel that some Pastors have watered down the message should endeavor to preach stronger message, but no one should tear down the Body because he believes people are not preaching strong message. It should grieve each of us that the standards that Christ set, which the Apostles handed down to us are being watered down, but that is the very reason to groan and cry to God for the Church and resist the Old Serpent who is deceiving and destroying the Body. We should not act as Satan’s hatchet men by striking the last blow to slay our fallen solders.

[Southerngal70]

I think he has an awesome message. He is not lying ..he gives the same messages as most philosophers and speakers.

[Southerngal70]

you got him all wrong. He isnt about money and fame. he is about passing on inspiration. Who are you people to judge anyway? I think the bible has some verses on judging others