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To: Natural Law

You’d have to ask someone who has a priestess and for all the different denominations I have attended over the years, I have yet to meet one.


137 posted on 06/08/2013 7:49:22 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

Repost, since other one came out funky:

“While it is true that no one seeks after God and no one can come to Him unless God draws him, I don’t see where, in this passage, it says that if God draws someone, it will guarantee their choosing Him.”


Why is the “and he said” colored blue in your quote? The ‘Therefore” is the explanation for the “some of you that believe not.” It’s not a separate strain of thought.

But as to the question:

Joh 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Or here:

Joh 10:25-30 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father’s name, they bear witness of me. (26) But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. (27) My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: (28) And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. (29) My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand. (30) I and my Father are one.

“God desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth (1 Timothy 2:4)


Barnes commentary on 1 Timothy 2:4

“That is, it is in accordance with his nature, his feelings, his desires. The word “will” cannot be taken here in the absolute sense, denoting a decree like that by which he willed the creation of the world, for then it would certainly be done. But the word is often used to denote a desire, wish, or what is in accordance with the nature of anyone. Thus it may be said of God that he “wills” that his creatures may be happy - because it is in accordance with his nature, and because he has made abundant provision for their happiness - though it is not true that he wills it in the sense that he exerts his absolute power to make them happy. God wills that sickness should be relieved, and sorrow mitigated, and that the oppressed should go free, because it is agreeable to his nature; though it is not true that he wills it in the sense that he exerts his absolute power to produce it. A parent wills the welfare of his child. It is in accordance with his nature, his feelings, his desires; and he makes every needful arrangement for it. If the child is not virtuous and happy, it is his own fault. So God wills that all people should be saved. It would be in accordance with his benevolent nature. He has made ample provision for it. He uses all proper means to secure their salvation. He uses no positive means to prevent it, and if they are not saved it will be their own fault. For places in the New Testament where the word here translated “will” (thelo), means to desire or wish, see Luk_8:20; Luk_23:8; Joh_16:19; Gal_4:20; Mar_7:24; 1Co_7:7; 1Co_11:3; 1Co_14:5; Mat_15:28.”

You should not confuse God’s decree of election with His desire to end all suffering or to save the entire world. That a man is not brought to believe does not take away his guilt for not believing. He is condemned for his own sins, for his own refusal. He loves the world, but He does not pray for the whole world. Only for those given to Him out of the world:

Joh 17:6-10 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word. (7) Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee. (8) For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me. (9) I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine. (10) And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

He does not predestinate those who believe. Rather, he foreknows and predestinates them so that they should believe.

Rom 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

He did not choose the willing, or those who are running, but rather those who did not seek Him and did not run at all.

Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Joh_15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.


141 posted on 06/08/2013 8:08:53 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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To: metmom
"You’d have to ask someone who has a priestess and for all the different denominations I have attended over the years, I have yet to meet one."

I have no way of knowing I didn't already.

142 posted on 06/08/2013 8:08:57 PM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a book, He left us a Church.)
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To: metmom
You’d have to ask someone who has a priestess and for all the different denominations I have attended over the years, I have yet to meet one. Just as last week you never heard of protestants blessing homosexual weddings.

That is your story and you are going to stick to it? Tell me what cave back in the middle of what woods do you live in? /SARC

155 posted on 06/09/2013 3:32:36 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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