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To: NYer
Bottom line: either God is Love and we are free to choose him or not, in our own act of Love, or God is a slave driver and, no matter what, what have to go to his heaven and live with Him for ever. In other words, freedom means choice, and choice permits the “no” to God. And thus there is hell.

Poor logic and completely Pelagian. There is another "choice".

God is NOT a slave drive. God is love, beauty, and perfection. God calls to us and keeps calling... and calling... and calling. We, in our nasty rebellious state want none of it. God gives us commandments to help us. We don't want to obey them. God gives us a promise land. We want to worship idols. God sends His Son. We kill Him. This is what man is all about and is there any question that we should not go to hell. In fact, given our history we would rather be in hell then to be with God in our natural state.

Make no mistake, God purposely has to change our hearts to follow Him. This isn't a "choice" because we would choose not to. And even when God has changed our hearts we half heartedly follow Him. He has to work out His will in us. Yet God is satisfied by His own goodness to welcome His prodical sons and daughters home and cloth us with His righteousness, put rings on our fingers and kills the fatted calf. This is the great love of the Father. He SAVED US and He who began a good work in us will complete it.

This is the grace of God to the glory of His name. Christians can only stand back and say, "Why me?" There is no answer to that question because we don't deserve anything.
7 posted on 05/28/2013 4:00:09 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD
"Bottom line: either God is Love and we are free to choose him or not, in our own act of Love, or God is a slave driver and, no matter what, what have to go to his heaven and live with Him for ever. In other words, freedom means choice, and choice permits the “no” to God. And thus there is hell."

Poor logic and completely Pelagian. There is another "choice".

If those first two descriptions are my only two choices, inspired Scripture leads me to vote "slave driver". However He makes each of us, we glorify God by serving His intended purpose for us:

You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?”
But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?”
Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?
What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction,
in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory—
even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?
-- Romans 9:19-24

No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him.
--John 6:44a


9 posted on 05/28/2013 4:24:01 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
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To: HarleyD

Amen to that...


10 posted on 05/28/2013 4:36:49 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: HarleyD

Oh Daddy!
Oh Daddy! My Father will always forgive me.

Why I sinned an broke the picket fence but Daddy will always forgive myself.

So I sinned again I broke the window Daddy will always forgive me.

I sinned and busted the pipes. Water is everywhere but Daddy will always forgive.

I do not have to humble myself Daddy will do it for me.

I have tears in me eyes Daddy does it all!

Why I am not responsible for myself. Daddy does it all by himself.

Oh Daddy declared me a spoiled brat.

I played with Matches. The Couch burned then caused the drapes to burn. Now No house anymore.

I have not seen my Daddy in a few weeks.

Why the last time he had a gun. He shot three bullets into my car.

I am three states away from Daddy.

He does everything I do not understand.

Oh Daddy! Oh Daddy!

I guess I am eternally separated

He did say “ I never want to see you again.”

Yet he still was running toward me with the Gun to get close to me.

I did not want to look like swiss cheese

Oh Dadddyyyyyy!!!

But Daddy I have tears in me eyes you do it all.

Daddy caught up with me!

I am now on a shelf being sold as Swiss Cheeseeeeee!

Oh!!! Daddy!

You do it All!

Echo!

Tears in me eyes!

Oh Daddddyyyyyyyyy

Don’t ya luv me anymore you do it all!!!

The above Swiss cheese was last seen on a ham sandwhich which was totally eaten.

The Parable of the no salt Swiss Cheeseeeeeee.........


14 posted on 05/29/2013 1:10:39 AM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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