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Pope Francis says atheists can do good and go to heaven too!
Catholic Online ^
| 5/24/2013
| Catholic Online
Posted on 05/24/2013 2:25:17 AM PDT by DaveMSmith
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To: piusv
Thanks for your post.
My take is the Pope is looking for a starting point - Charity and Goodwill first and faith will grow from there. If one looks to do good (with the implication they will reject evil), then the 'faith of a mustard seed' can be planted.
Looking at 12 step programs, I see this all the time - they all are programs of repentance. I believe once started, the Lord will guide us to eternal life, thus salvation - whatever we call Him.
BTW. the 'heaven' in the title is from the source, catholic.org - that's why I added salvation to the keywords.
41
posted on
05/24/2013 4:41:16 AM PDT
by
DaveMSmith
(Evil Comes from Falsity, So Share the Truth)
To: gemoftheocean
"If an atheist consistently does the WILL OF THE FATHER then he too can be saved.""Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? Jesus answered and said unto them,This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent" (John 6:28,29)
For an atheist to do the work of God he must first cease to be an atheist.
42
posted on
05/24/2013 4:42:56 AM PDT
by
mitch5501
("make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things ye shall never fall")
To: cuban leaf
Luke 10:25 And behold, a certain lawyer stood up and tested Him, saying, "Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"
Eternal LIFE is not salvation?
43
posted on
05/24/2013 4:44:23 AM PDT
by
DaveMSmith
(Evil Comes from Falsity, So Share the Truth)
To: SpirituTuo
If we are all a unique creation of the Father, and if His sacrifice was once, and for all, then why are we not all children of God? Because I'm pretty sure both Scripture and Church Sacred Tradition make it clear that it is in Baptism that we become children or sons of God. We may all be made in the image and likeness of God but that doesn't necessarily mean we are all children of God. Once again, it is in accepting His Son that we become part of God's Family. Atheists (and others ) have not done that (yet).
44
posted on
05/24/2013 4:47:24 AM PDT
by
piusv
To: DaveMSmith
"- whatever we call Him"Hopefully I'm just reading you wrong but just in case...
"Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved" (Acts 4:12)
45
posted on
05/24/2013 4:49:10 AM PDT
by
mitch5501
("make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things ye shall never fall")
To: Vendome
In fact, it is in doing good that they are led to the One who is the Source of all that is good. In essence he simply restated the hope of the Church that all come to know God, through His Son Jesus Christ. Seems like he is just stating what the Bible already tells us - Jesus died for ALL of us and ALL of our sins. ANYONE who seeks him and confesses their sinfulness and acknowledges Him as Lord and Savior can be saved.
It would seem that his gist was that Christ saves you - not any particular religion or institution. I find it refreshing to see a Pope who doesn't consider membership in the Catholic Church to be a requirement for salvation. The use of "catholic" in the Apostle's Creed had nothing to do with the Catholic Church - it was a term for open-to-all/all-purpose, etc.
46
posted on
05/24/2013 4:54:29 AM PDT
by
trebb
(Where in the the hell has my country gone?)
To: SubMareener
He sounds more like an American to me...in a good way, that is.
47
posted on
05/24/2013 4:55:18 AM PDT
by
equaviator
(There's nothing like the universe to bring you down to earth.)
To: piusv
Honestly, the Pope should stop speaking off the cuff and write, edit and re-edit his homilies. They are all over the internet/the world these days...and they will be misconstrued.
I know how he feels. We’ve all experienced that. ;-)
48
posted on
05/24/2013 4:57:20 AM PDT
by
cuban leaf
(Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
To: DaveMSmith
"Eternal LIFE is not salvation?"Not necessarily...
Revelation 14:11 "And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name."
49
posted on
05/24/2013 4:58:12 AM PDT
by
mitch5501
("make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things ye shall never fall")
To: DaveMSmith
Pope Francis says atheists can do good and go to heaven too! The funny thing is that I first heard this quote reported to be my an atheist (who had no reason to make this up), except that he didn't mention the part about going to heaven, probably because he has no interest in it (and doesn't believe it's there any way).
50
posted on
05/24/2013 5:00:54 AM PDT
by
Tanniker Smith
(Rome didn't fall in a day, either.)
Comment #51 Removed by Moderator
To: Cyclops08
This wouldn't be an example of papal infallibility. Papal infallibility pertains to times when any Pope proclaims by a definitive act a doctrine pertaining to faith or morals. It does not mean that everything a Pope says will be infallible.
Regardless, most of what is being called "wrong" here is simply a misunderstanding of what he is saying. IMHO, I do think that his comment about children of God is wrong (although I do hope I am also just misunderstanding him).
52
posted on
05/24/2013 5:02:40 AM PDT
by
piusv
To: DaveMSmith
BZZZZTTTT. Yes, Alex. I'll take Biblical Truth for $100. The answer is “Name the pope that early in his papacy, declared that the way to heaven was by works and not the grace of God.” That would be Pope Francis the Mistake, Alex.
Right! For $100. By his assertion, no one needs Christ, God, the Virgin Mary for salvation, let alone repentance or the need to pay another red cent to get a priest to pray someone out of purgatory.
Choose again.
53
posted on
05/24/2013 5:02:52 AM PDT
by
cashless
(Obama told us he would side with Muslims if the political winds shifted in an ugly direction. Ready?)
To: DaveMSmith
Luke 10:25 And behold, a certain lawyer stood up and tested Him, saying, “Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?”
Eternal LIFE is not salvation?
Salvation means salvation from death. Withouth salvation, we all go the way of any other animal. The only difference is that those not saved will be resurrected before the second and more permanent death. You are saved from that when you receive eternal life. So, from a Christian context, eternal life and salvation mean the same thing. You are given eternal life and that is your salvation from death.
And Jesus answer to the man was the key part:
What is written in the Law? he replied. How do you read it?
He answered, Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind[c]; and, Love your neighbor as yourself.
You have answered correctly, Jesus replied. Do this and you will live.
54
posted on
05/24/2013 5:03:16 AM PDT
by
cuban leaf
(Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
To: DaveMSmith
Wow, just read the rest of the comments on this thread.
I'll be leaving this discussion now because I don't see any good coming out of it.
55
posted on
05/24/2013 5:03:34 AM PDT
by
Tanniker Smith
(Rome didn't fall in a day, either.)
To: trebb
Well, that simply was not the export of what he said.
He attempted to lead us to believe that even an atheist could be saved.
The nature of their belief is at odds with the gift of salvation and God’s word.
I’ll. Take the box Carol Meryl is standing in front of.
56
posted on
05/24/2013 5:05:42 AM PDT
by
Vendome
(Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
To: Tanniker Smith
LOL....I’ll predict another 1,100 post count of Bible Tug-of-War between Bible only Christians and Catholics.
57
posted on
05/24/2013 5:06:04 AM PDT
by
piusv
To: Salamander
58
posted on
05/24/2013 5:06:25 AM PDT
by
Vendome
(Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
To: DaveMSmith
I’m of the unorthodox view that a person who’s never heard the gospel might be granted grace at judgment based on his heart (longing to know the God he hadn’t been formally introduced to); however, if a person has consciously rejected God out of human pride, I really don’t see any number of “good” works offsetting that.
59
posted on
05/24/2013 5:08:01 AM PDT
by
william clark
(Ecclesiastes 10:2)
To: mitch5501
I think the opposite of eternal life is death or eternal damnation. Your quote does not state 'life' for those tormented.
Actually, it's funny you quote that verse - Swedenborg says it is the fate of those who are of faith divorced from charity that falsify the Word.
60
posted on
05/24/2013 5:09:48 AM PDT
by
DaveMSmith
(Evil Comes from Falsity, So Share the Truth)
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