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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

**As for John 14, there is nothing to dodge in there at all.**

That good! Because I’m going to take a stroll through there, starting with one of my favorite verses.....yep the one you quoted:

“At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.” John 14:20

Notice Jesus Christ said, “AT THAT DAY”. What day?...the day when people are filled with his Spirit (aka Comforter, aka Holy Ghost).

He started out explaining how he is the Father’s express image in divinity: “..he that hath seen me hath seen the Father (9)....the Father that dwelleth IN ME, he doeth the works.” (10); but the Son in humanity: “..the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself...”.(10). “..and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me”. (24). He of his own self could do nothing. Why?...because the man Christ Jesus was not sent to do his own will, but the Father that sent him. John 5:30. But, back to ‘AT THAT DAY”.....

The Christ said that the Comforter will not come unless he goes away. 16:7. AND told the disciples in 14:17 “ye know him for he dwelleth with you, and shall be IN you. “I will not leave you comfortless: I will COME to you.” (18). How?...as the Comforter.

He had to go away physically, because he couldn’t abide physically with ‘whosover will’ constantly. It’s not physically possible. He had to return as the Comforter so that ‘whosoever will’ can receive of him, and because of his being poured out, “..the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.” 14:12

**Christ even says that the Father is in Him, and HE is in the Father. And then WE are in Christ.**

Yes, but only after being filled with his Spirit.

17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

And I like how he started into that prayer (17:3)...”And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the ONLY true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.”

Jesus Christ is God because ALL the fulness of the ONLY God dwells in him. (Col. 1:19; 2:9)


674 posted on 05/14/2013 4:21:15 PM PDT by Zuriel (Acts 2:38,39....nearly 2,000 years and still working today!)
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To: Zuriel

” I’m going to take a stroll through there, starting with one of my favorite verses.....yep the one you quoted:”


Presumably you harped on John 14 in the first place in order to argue that the whenever Jesus Christ declares Himself to be God, that He was really just kidding. That doesn’t appear to be what you’re saying now, though, since you didn’t address what I actually said.

“How?...as the Comforter.”


Here’s the Father speaking out of heaven, the Holy Spirit in the air above descending on the Son, and Jesus Christ beneath. Three separate persons.

Mark 1:10-12
(10) And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him:(11) And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. (12) And immediately the spirit driveth him into the wilderness.

Here is the Lord God and His Spirit sending the Son:

Isaiah 48:16
Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord God, and his Spirit, hath sent me.

Here’s the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, being named in a farewell:

2 Corinthians 13:14
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

In other words, Jesus Christ is not the Holy Spirit.

So what’s your next idea?


676 posted on 05/14/2013 5:09:05 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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