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To: NYer; All

“It is the Spirit himself whom we received in Baptism”


Water baptism in and of itself has no power to give the Holy Spirit. An example of this is with Cornelius and his family, who received the Holy Spirit prior to water immersion:

Act 10:44-47 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. (45) And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. (46) For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, (47) Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

If water baptism is necessary to receive the Holy Spirit, then every instance of the Holy Spirit filling/baptizing the believer must be at the instigation of water baptism. However, the scripture never teaches that the Spirit is bound to human activity. The Spirit, in all actuality, moves on man, reveals the person of Christ to man, and regenerates Him, all according to His own good purpose and will, and not on any foreseen works of the man.


3 posted on 05/09/2013 4:16:06 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans
"If water baptism is necessary...

Show me in Scripture where you get the notion that everyone has exactly the same plan for Salvation and that all are equal?

Peace be with you

4 posted on 05/09/2013 4:21:36 PM PDT by Natural Law (Peace is not the absence of war, it is the completeness of communion with God.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

How can you say, “Water baptism in and of itself has no power to give the Holy Spirit”?

“Jesus answered, ‘Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.” -John 3:5


7 posted on 05/09/2013 4:45:35 PM PDT by MDLION ("Trust in the Lord with all your heart" -Proverbs 3:5)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Cornelius and his family are not the norm, but the exception that proves the norm. Meaning, Peter and those with him were shocked to see that the Holy Ghost came upon Cornelius because he was Gentile and not Jew.

It was because of this that Gentiles were accepted as believers.

But, Scripture notes that immediately following, Cornelius and his family were baptized. Peter says, how could we deny or forbid water that they should not be baptized. In other words, who are we to deny them the saving waters of baptism if the Spirit has chosen to come to them?

So, clearly, Peter would not have baptized Cornelius without having first witnessed the Holy Ghost coming to him.

God is not bound by human actions, but humans are bound by God’s commands. Jesus says one must be baptized and that is the norm, but there are exceptions which only God can make.


32 posted on 05/09/2013 7:30:14 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Did not Jesus say at the end of Mathew’s Gospel to go and baptized all people?


43 posted on 05/09/2013 11:44:03 PM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans
If water baptism is necessary to receive the Holy Spirit, then every instance of the Holy Spirit filling/baptizing the believer must be at the instigation of water baptism.

Fundamental logical error. Just because God has prescribed something as "necessary" for us, it does not follow that he is bound by that rule -- unless He wishes to be. He's the boss; he gets to call the shots.

Or, as St. Thomas Aquinas pithily put it, "God is not bound by the sacraments".

46 posted on 05/10/2013 5:10:56 AM PDT by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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