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To: ilovesarah2012

Well, in responding to your post, I checked Wikipedia, (yea, I admit I’m not a genius), and according to their entry, St. Helena contracted to do excavation in an area near around a Roman Temple and three crosses were unearthed. (In the process she destroyed the Roman Temple). It is said that she wanted proof positive as to which of the crosses was the one upon which Christ was hung so she ordered that a sick woman be brought to the site and had the woman touch the crosses. The first two had no effect, but upon touching the third, she was immediately and miraculously healed.

I somewhat recall having heard that story in the 1970’s from my Grandmother, whose name was Helen and her patron saint was St. Helena and she had made quite a study of St. Helena’s adventures in life, (and they were plentiful). I’m a “believer” and active Roman Catholic and love the tale and would love to believe it true, but as well, I lived in Rome for 3 years and am quite an avid student of Roman history and have to tell you I’m somewhat skeptical.

On the one hand, I do believe that Helena was quite meticulous, wise and a very strong and determined woman, (and wealthy as well having made an “Augusta” Co-Empress of the Empire), but all of that notwithstanding, the truth of the matter is that Crucifixion was as common in the Empire as sacrifices to Quetzelcotle were in Mexico City, (and they had hundreds of yards of Skull racks lining their Main Street). In fact, hundreds of criminals and insurgents were crucified a month; the main roads into the major cities were lined with crosses upon which people hung. And from the histories I’ve read, they re-used the crosses over and over again. Along major Roman roads, you’ll see stones into which have been carved square holes into which they set crosses. Travellers knew they were approaching a major Roman city when they started to pass crosses adorned with the drooping bodies of the dead and/or dying along the road.

So, like..........really? What are the chances? And of course, to make matters worse, Helena, in Jerusalem, was in a virtual Christian tourist trap. At that time, the major industry was catering to Pilgrims from all over coming to see Jerusalem and the place where Jesus was crucified. The roads and streets would have been litered with people selling “sacred” artifacts. They probably had “sacred” artifact factories! I haven’t been to Jerusalem, but I’d be willing to bet there are tourist shops there, even today, where you can buy pieces of the true cross and the real nails and the crown of thorns. Its been a racket for 2000 years!


43 posted on 03/28/2013 1:41:18 PM PDT by Rich21IE
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To: Rich21IE

All of this is irrelevant.

Since 1898, it has been known that the image on the Shroud is a photographic negative—a thing that no human being could have conceived, let alone produced, before the advent of photography. Repeated attempts by competent artists, in modern times, to paint negatives, have produced nothing but grotesque images.

Since 1978, it has been discovered that the gradations of the image on the Shroud correspond to the DISTANCE of the surfaces of the body on the Shroud from the surface of the cloth—something that no one was capable of conceiving or detecting before digital analysis of images was possible.

Since 1978, it has been discovered that the image exists on the surface of the fibers of the Shroud—that no pigment or other material foreign to the fabric itself is present.

Anyone who suggests that this image was produced by hand—in the Middle Ages or any other time—is simply ignoring a vast body of hard data about the Shroud, and is an idle, irresponsible dilettante.


45 posted on 03/28/2013 2:44:28 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan (If you're FOR sticking scissors in a female's neck and sucking out her brains, you are PRO-WOMAN!)
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To: Rich21IE

Reminds me of all the “Cherokee” artifacts in Cherokee, NC and you look on the back of them and they say “Made in China”. LOL

Still, I have been amazed by the Shroud for many years and the first time I could plainly see the image of the face in a picture, I got chills and tears. I would love to know what Jesus looked like and the Shroud gives me an idea.


47 posted on 03/28/2013 3:19:03 PM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: Rich21IE
Helen came to the Holy City, which had been totally destroyed and reshaped and renamed by the Emperor Hadrian in the 130s, after the last great Jewish uprising against Roman rule. Very likely there was a Christian memorial of some sort at the site of the crucifixion, which may have been the reason for the erection of the temple on the site. But Jews, including Christian Jews were forbidden to live in what now became a Roman garrison town. Not an easy place to get to, one can assume, nor a place welcoming to pilgrims. The Church grew greatly over the next two hundred years, but after 250, it was savagely persecuted up until the time of Constantine’s victory. After that time, it DID become a major attraction, and renamed Jerusalem, it was filled with churches. The Church of the Holy Sepulcher is said to had a dome that was about twice as high as it is now, and that after the Muslims took the city, they built the dome of the rock more or less as a replica’ of the one that Helen built. So your cynicism is misplaced. Only after she came did it become a “ tourist trap.”
49 posted on 03/28/2013 3:40:38 PM PDT by RobbyS
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