Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: roamer_1
For instance, if Mary was born without original sin, how can that be, when Adam's sin is passed down through the father...

Scripture says nothing at all about "Adam's sin" being passed down through the father. Catholics understand original sin principally as the absence of God's indwelling divine life anyway, and you don't pass down an absence -- you fail to pass down the presence to whose lack the absence corresponds.

As to your question about aging and death, freedom from those evils were lost by Adam's sin, and Mary was not given them back. In that sense, she was less blessed than Eve originally was! The loss of those freedoms (called "preternatural gifts" by theologians) isn't the essence original sin, however.

42 posted on 01/12/2013 2:32:41 PM PST by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies ]


To: Campion
Hi Campion,

Scripture says nothing at all about "Adam's sin" being passed down through the father.

That is not precisely so. The very idea of 'original sin' requires some sort of inheritance... And Biblical inheritance, with very few exceptions, is paternal. Federated headship is not only described in sin and it's curses, but also in blessings. I will grant you that we don't know the particulars thereof, it's eventual use and limitations, but it is not right to say it is not mentioned. I am not prone to a universalist construction, but these things are the very essence that drives universalism. The structures that serve it are there. Perhaps in ignoring such things we may do damage to the scope of the power presented in the resurrection. Does not Yeshua state that if He is lifted up on high, He will draw all things to Him?

"you fail to pass down the presence to whose lack the absence corresponds." <== *blink* *blink*... whoa, d00d. That there is some incredible syntactic mastertude, man. I looked at that and felt like I ran out of quarters before the rinse cycle, but I got 'er done. :)

Catholics understand original sin principally as the absence of God's indwelling divine life anyway, and you don't pass down an absence -- you fail to pass down the presence to whose lack the absence corresponds.

'Principally,' perhaps, but then one would suppose the onset of such a condition would be technically described in the Fall of Man - And that also raises the observation that the very breath of life is divine, so I would consider such a statement to be at least limited in action, lest we would have all crumbled back to dust forthwith. Or perhaps you are describing something higher up the corporate chain... a strategic partial withdrawal from all of creation might be a bit more palatable to me.

As to your question about aging and death, freedom from those evils were lost by Adam's sin, and Mary was not given them back. In that sense, she was less blessed than Eve originally was! The loss of those freedoms (called "preternatural gifts" by theologians) isn't the essence original sin, however.

Again, I find myself unable to concur with precision:

What you describe ties into the statement preceding it, and seems to be ignorant of the wider ramifications of the curse. All of creation waits breathlessly for it's repair, which at the least implies a more universal condition, and which must practically descend even into the realm of the physical - How else can Righteous YHWH justly hold the sin of one man against countless generations? No... I think that the actions of Man that day in Eden forced some sort of containment which no thing born of it can escape. Even the righteous souls who passed on prior to the cross were held in quarantine at Paradise. This is indicative of the mechanism's design, and is also indicative of why One from outside of the containment must needfully come to open the door of release.

In that line of thinking, suggesting that one who came from inside (born of) could be outside (born without original sin, born outside of the containment) defies the very logic of it's design.

51 posted on 01/13/2013 9:03:17 AM PST by roamer_1 (Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson