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To: Phinneous

You are being charitable, but Scripture testifies that, like us, they were overall rebellious and drew back in faith in the tests they faced, which i have shown i can do as well.

Thus the testimony of Moses was, “Ye have been rebellious against the Lord from the day that I knew you. “ (Deuteronomy 9:24) See also Ps. 78, 106.

And the overall rejection of the Messiah was that of Jesus Christ.


73 posted on 11/26/2012 4:16:09 PM PST by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: daniel1212

I believe I said that the explanation I was giving (that of the Jews desiring a leader like the image (of an ox) that they saw on G-d’s chariot) was part of the depth of Torah. Yes, as you indicate, the simple reading of the verse indicates that they were rebellious.

However, as you quoted, they rebelled against G-d. (not Moses.)

Answer for me please (for all Christians—don’t worry, they won’t mind,) do Christians reject all Jewish scholarship on the Torah? (the works I referenced in one of my first or second post...another link: http://www.myjewishlearning.com/texts/Rabbinics/Midrash/Midrash_Halakhah/Sifra-Sifre.shtml) I would assume yes, they do, because it detracts from your last point, about “...the overall rejection of Messiah...”

I have a point, other than stating definitively that Jews don’t believe JC was supernatural.... we can calmly debate that elsewhere, or not...

BUT our depth of Torah goes beyond the literal, poorly translated verse you are relying on. In the beginning G-d created..... ...and the world was chaos and void... etc... Jews know that there were spiritual (dimensions, if you please) before our physical world’s creation. We know that Adam’s long life began at year one, on the first Rosh Hashana of the planet. We know that there aren’t “gaps” as others have explained. We know that, although not mentioned once in Genesis, Avram (later Avraham) at the age of 3 conceived that there must be one G-d who created everything and began a life-long search for Him. Our sages told us! They had divine inspiration. Our ancestors received the Torah and it’s 613 commandments, practical, defined, objective for Jews, and 7 for non-Jews (www.noahide.org.)

And anyone can read my first post on the thread to understand that science cannot “prove” how old the earth is. That’s the bottom line for Bible believers on this thread.


74 posted on 11/26/2012 5:15:41 PM PST by Phinneous
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