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To: HannibalHamlinJr
This incarnation of liberty is over. That’s not a sad thing ... it’s what happens. The question is what’s next.

Here's one possibility from John Derbyshire. Long, but worth the read.

____________________________________________________________

As I have been saying, there is no unity among white Americans. The old splits of education, class, sex, religion, city-country, and of course North-South still divide whites, and that is the basis of most of our politics. The Republican Party is white, sure enough, but whites aren't Republican.

This will presumably be less and less the case as whites head for minority status. At some point the fact of impending minority status will sink in, and whites will begin to sink their differences and circle the wagons. At some point the Lee Kuan Yew principle will take over. I've quoted it before, and I'll quote it again, because it's very quotable in this context. Quote from Lee Kuan Yew, who was Prime Minister of Singapore for thirty years, and the power behind the curtain for a further twenty in that very successful city-state, quote:

'In multiracial societies, you don't vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.'

http://www.johnderbyshire.com/Opinions/RadioDerb/2012-11-10.html

16 posted on 11/09/2012 11:00:29 PM PST by Ken H
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To: Ken H
That may be the most dead on response I've ever gotten - thanks for sending it. And a bizarre thing happened as I was reading ... I was thinking "this is just like ...." ... and then derby went right into it.

There is one thing - not something I necessarily disagree with, but I think is left out. in reality this isn't about race ... it's about ideas, but ideas have been circumscribed by the most fatal flaw of man - mistaking the manifest for the unmanifest. That's a vague sentence, so ...

I always use the example of Golden Retrievers and Black Labs. As a human, as past employee, as an employer, as a party goer, friend, family member, member of this or that social group ... I just say "Give me the smartest, the most positive, the hardest working, the most committed" ... those are the coin of the realm in my life.

Fur color ... if you're a dog, is not (usually) and indication of anything. Nor is eye color.

I never understood racism - I just can't grasp it ... it's totally unintelligent. To me, the only reason blacks are a cogent group rallying around victimhood is not their color, but the very mistake that made their ancestors victims is the very mistake they are perpetuating, that they are somehow different. Had whites reproduced in Africa, and Blacks in northern locals, Blacks would have had a hand up in technology, and enslaved whites. It's a mistake of history whose victimes are only casually correlated to color. Just as it was blacks who sold blacks into slavery, and were already enslaving blacks, today, they are destroying themselves at a far higher rate than whites. But it could have been brown and yellow, red and green.

So where I differ from John is ... and this is where I did that "wow this makes me think of ... " thing which was followed by exactly that ... is that I don't believe most Republicans are actually racist or ethnicists. I'm making the leap that they are like me. I just don't give a sh*t ... smart, positive, hard working etc ... THAT part is about values.

But if you get sent to prison, and 3 out of 4 'colors' of people band together, under the ridiculous flag that 'oh we just happen to think alike' ... then what choice do you have? You put on the 'white' uniform not because you believe it's a uniform that means anything really, but because if you don't, you'll die.

Slaves are black as a mistake of history. But so are Republicans. Proper Republicans don't see color - we are far more like MLK's speech (as a human, I'm not sure he was so great) ... but in my experience, average breathing Republicans and even simple Democrat voters ... WE DON'T CARE about race. But now we're forced to ... because if color and ethnicity is the coin of the realm, and those wearing different color uniforms want to kill anyone in the white uniform ... if stupidity is the coin of the realm ... then out of self preservation you circle the wagon based on that.

"Prison" was the simile I had in mind just when John wrote about it one sentence later. Sure, some Aryans in prison really are racists, but I'd be willing to bet most just identify that way for survival.

There is so much more to say ... but in prison, if 4 of the 5 colors individually unite among themselves, then the 5th better do so too, even if it's only a means of survival. It's as stupid as the football team in your hometown actually being your favorite. Football's fun, so it doesn't matter - I indulge in it myself ... but human value ... once you associate based on uniform color and brand, you're f*cked as a species - everyone is f*cked, and man's progress is locked.

That's why I keep saying to friends who care about this - it's all about demographics, which is based on identity, not ideas.

The issue of racism is entirely about man having progressed to the point where possibly he can pay attention to the invisible rather than the visible, but he doesn't do so in great enough numbers.

I'd be proud to be white ... except that's not what I'm proud of ... I'm proud to be a simple dog, living on the earth, who never stops to consider if he's a golden retriever or black lab. I just want to go around hanging out with smart, hard working, passionate other dogs. But if all the other dogs are addicted to sub-sub-species - based not on ideas and merit, but based on a combination of fur color and history which is itself a result of fur color, then it's a hostile planet upon which I'm not necessarily enlightened, but smart, to circle the wagon.

People of like ideas should circle the wagon, not people of like attributes, attributes which bear no real correlation to value. I believe among most whites and east asians, we function on the principle that merit is all that matters (and hence, not surprisingly, those two groups accelerate,) and it's born out in that Obama has received 4 trillion billion more votes from intelligent people than he ever deserved, and yet blacks and hispanics vote for him at 90% and 70% respectively. Yes, it's the same as prison.

Thanks for sending that - it's been years since I read him ... he's changed, become more sure of himself on this stuff. My only disagreement, which may not be a disagreement at all, is that the fact that it manifests as 'color politics' is due to a fundamental error, but a habitual one, among man. I don't think Republicans, as much as I've had it with them, share the problem - what I see is that Obama wants people to be identified with color, because it benefits his vision or lack of one.

For Obama, that visit to his drunkard father's grave was not about anything spiritual, it was about whether he would embrace or hate one color or another. He chose his father's color, his father's ideology - the very ideas that turned him into a drunk in the first place, that killed him, and that have kept Kenya in the trash. It's really about ideas, but among an electorate that's still hypnotized by color and ethnic origin, it isn't, because their only idea is "my color, my most recent country, my false sense of identity."

Sorry - no editing ...thanks for the response.

19 posted on 11/10/2012 4:20:55 AM PST by HannibalHamlinJr
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