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To: Natural Law
That is patently ridiculous. Was the divinity of Jesus during His ministry on Earth merely a matter of perception since the elements of His fully human body were still present?

No, it isn't ridiculous. What IS ridiculous is all the word play and semantic games that must take place to try to get to the place where Catholics have to believe in the "real presence", properly confected by the "right" guy in the "right" garments saying the "right" words in order to really believe they are eating their savior and have a chance at salvation. I honestly think it took awhile for all the thinking heads to hash it out over the centuries, taking a little bit here a little bit there, to come up with the idea that what you can't physically see, really physically IS there. That is a far cry from believing that Jesus was really and truly God incarnated, Almighty God became a man, took on human flesh and blood and endured the horrendous agony and humiliation of the cross so that we can be redeemed by His shed blood.

I wish Catholic apologists would stop and think about what they are really getting across when they toe the "party" line and exclude the other believing Christians of the world from the fellowship of the Body of Christ. We are not saved by how we "see" the elements of the Lord's Supper observance but by how we see Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith.

161 posted on 08/20/2012 8:22:12 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: boatbums
"I wish Catholic apologists would stop and think about what they are really getting across when they toe the "party" line and exclude the other believing Christians of the world from the fellowship of the Body of Christ."

That acceptance of Catholic doctrine and dogma (aka the "party line") is a thoughtless act is a common theme amongst Protestant apologists. Not only is it insulting, but it is patently false.

Catholic doctrine recognizes and embraces mysteries. Protestantism often treats a mystery as a failure of human reason. For Catholics mysteries are are not things that are inherently self contradictory or require cognitive dissonance. We see mysteries for what they are; ideas and beliefs beyond the capability of humans to fully fathom, but not beyond a faith based acceptance.

This goes to the core of our understanding of divine revelation. Catholics believe that divine revelation is the vehicle God uses to share knowledge not otherwise achievable by science and human understanding. That is why we find it so grotesque when Protestantism attempts to subordinate mysteries and divine revelation to human reason.

To expect that Catholics will be swayed from their faith based positions by the literary skills and persuasive arguments of Protestant apologists, amateur and professional is preposterous. Frankly, it smacks of spiritual pride; that love of self for the love of God, that is the antithesis of holiness and contradicts the love of other.

Peace be with you.

173 posted on 08/21/2012 8:45:37 AM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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