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To: patlin

One only has to take a quick read of the early church council canons, starting in 321 AD, to see that the entire doctrine of Christianity is nothing more than doctrine and traditions of man. They openly admit that there is NO Scriptural basis for any of the changes made other than to make it more convenient for pagans to join the church. Body count & political religious power! That is the core foundation for ALL of the tossing out of God’s Way (Ps 119:1). And then there is the fact that the Catholic church admits it and is proud of it! Arrogance is such an unflattering trait and it is an abomination in the eyes of God. (2 Peter)


I agree with what you say about tradition on the points that i understand especially the Sabbath day, The Sabbath day can not be changed and was not changed but it looks to me like the early Christians did hold church service on the first day of the week and that was in keeping the Sabbath, the seventh day.

Holding church service is not resting and a day of rest is what the Sabbath was for.


Mark ch 22
2
And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

28
Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.


holding church service on sunday is appropriate because it is the day Jesus rose and it is also the day of Pentecost
but it is not the Sabbath.

The Catholic Church claims to have changed the Sabbath from the seventh day of the week to the first day of the week and like you say they admit there is no scripture even hints at such a thing.

Can you imagine the turmoil that would have taken place and that we would be reading about in the new testament if such a thing had of even been mentioned?

Another thing that was started by the same church was tithes, there is no authority what so ever of any one except the Levitic priests to collect tithes.


144 posted on 08/02/2012 10:46:48 AM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: ravenwolf
Ignatius to the Philippians

These things, brethren, out of the affection which I entertain for you, I have felt compelled to write, exhorting you with a view to the glory of God, not as if I were a person of any consequence, but simply as a brother. Be ye subject to the bishop, to the presbyters, and to the deacons. Love one another in the Lord, as being the images of God. Take heed, ye husbands, that ye love your wives as your own members. Ye wives also, love your husbands, as being one with them in virtue of your union. If any one lives in chastity or continence, let him not be lifted up, lest he lose his reward. Do not lightly esteem the festivals. Despise not the period of forty days, for it comprises an imitation of the conduct of the Lord. After the week of the passion, do not neglect to fast on the fourth and sixth days, distributing at the same time of thine abundance to the poor. If any one fasts on the Lord’s Day or on the Sabbath, except on the paschal Sabbath only, he is a murderer of Christ.

Ignatius to the Ephesians

If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death—whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ, our only Master—how shall we be able to live apart from Him, whose disciples the prophets themselves in the Spirit did wait for Him as their Teacher? And therefore He whom they rightly waited for, being come, raised them from the dead.

If, then, those who were conversant with the ancient Scriptures came to newness of hope, expecting the coming of Christ, as the Lord teaches us when He says, “If ye had believed Moses, ye would have believed Me, for he wrote of Me;” and again, “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it, and was glad; for before Abraham was, I am;” how shall we be able to live without Him? The prophets were His servants, and foresaw Him by the Spirit, and waited for Him as their Teacher, and expected Him as their Lord and Saviour, saying, “He will come and save us.” Let us therefore no longer keep the Sabbath after the Jewish manner, and rejoice in days of idleness; for “he that does not work, let him not eat.” For say the [holy] oracles, “In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat thy bread.”But let every one of you keep the Sabbath after a spiritual manner, rejoicing in meditation on the law, not in relaxation of the body, admiring the workmanship of God, and not eating things prepared the day before, nor using lukewarm drinks, and walking within a prescribed space, nor finding delight in dancing and plaudits which have no sense in them. And after the observance of the Sabbath, let every friend of Christ keep the Lord’s Day as a festival, the resurrection-day, the queen and chief of all the days [of the week]. Looking forward to this, the prophet declared, “To the end, for the eighth day,”on which our life both sprang up again, and the victory over death was obtained in Christ, whom the children of perdition, the enemies of the Saviour, deny, “whose god is their belly, who mind earthly things,” who are “lovers of pleasure, and not lovers of God, having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof.” These make merchandise of Christ, corrupting His word, and giving up Jesus to sale: they are corrupters of women, and covetous of other men’s possessions, swallowing up wealth insatiably; from whom may ye be delivered by the mercy of God through our Lord Jesus Christ!

So we see very early on, they were already moving to ADD to God's Law and eventually that addition ended in the taking God completely out of the equation and replacing man's authority over God's.

And while I agree with you that Messiah ascended to the Father on the first day of the week, he rose from the grave on his Sabbath, 72 hrs after being put in the grave prior to the High Sabbath of Passover beginning at sundown according to the law in Dt 21:23, therefore placing his resurrection prior to sunset on the 7th day Sabbath. And that is where I think the big mistake is. Taking the ascension and the resurrection and making them to mean one single event when they are two distinct events that happened at two distinct times. He had to defeat death on the Sabbath and then be the first fruits of the 7th Day resurrection on its appointed day, the morrow after the weekly Sabbath following the High Sabbath of Passover.

John 20:17 Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, ‘I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.’ “

As Messiah was resurrected on the Sabbath, so shall all of God's children be resurrected on the Sabbath, the Millennial Sabbath reign of Messiah. It is ALL prophesy being revealed to us if we just have eyes to see and ears to hear what the Father is trying to reveal to us.

145 posted on 08/02/2012 2:43:48 PM PDT by patlin ("Knowledge is a powerful source that is 2nd to none but God" ConstitutionallySpeaking 2011)
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