Posted on 05/17/2012 5:40:57 PM PDT by Gamecock
Did you notice it didn’t say Catholic Church or any church for that matter?
Do you always talk about people behind their back?
The apostles knew that Peter was not the leader of the group.
"Now there arose a dispute among them, which of them was reputed to be the greatest. But he said to them, 'The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them, and they who exercise authority over them are called Benefactors. But not so with you. On the contrary, let him who is greatest among you become as the youngest, and him who is chief as the servant.'" (Luke 22:24-26).
The very fact that the apostles had an argument among themselves shows they did not understand that Peter was to be prince. Also, the occasion of the argument was the night of the betrayal--the last night of the Lord's earthly ministry--and yet the apostles still did not understand that Christ had given Peter a position of primacy. The Lord settled the argument, not by stating that He had already made Peter head, but by declaring that the Gentiles have their heads, "But not so with you." Thus, Jesus very plainly taught that no one would occupy any such place as a Benefactor (or Pope) to exercise authority over the others.
The Catholic church has attempted to bolster it's authority by tradition, looking back and claiming roles for Peter and others like someone named Clement whereas there is no support in the Scriptures for these claims.
And when tradition and Scripture conflict it will always be tradition that is favored..
Dear CYC, I had post #1384 removed and apologize to you because it was inappropriate and mean
I will confess this sin at my next confession
I don't take offence easily nor do I suppose that anyone is bad because of their views so it's not personal to me at all. At the end of day we're sharing our opinions with whatever value that may have.
Great stuff, eh? So sharpen your blade and I'll see you on the green.
Or one of its synonyms that does not attribute motive (i.e. does not "make it personal") such as: capricious, conflicting, discordant, dissonant, incompatible, incongruent, irreconcilable.
That's because we don't need priests any more because the system of sacrifices is over and done with.
Jesus is our great high priest, making intercession for us before God and His sacrifice did away with sins.
Hebrews 10:10-18 10 And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11 And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when Christ[b] had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13 waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. 14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.
15 And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying, 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,”
17 then he adds, “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”
18 Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.
Does that mean the Greek?
I already posted the Greek words in post 1,389. *Elder* is the correct translation. *Priest* is not.
“Inconsistent.
Or one of its synonyms that does not attribute motive (i.e. does not “make it personal”) such as: capricious, conflicting, discordant, dissonant, incompatible, incongruent, irreconcilable.”
~ ~ ~
It’s pretty obvious, by the thousands, Protestants are “inconsistent” in their beliefs about God’s Word, the result of professing heresy.
Thanks for replying RM. Interesting, those words you gave me show the fruit of private judgment. Will you comment on the heresy of private judgment?
The perfect example was given to show why private judgment which means personal interpretation of Scripture is heresy.
Taking the same two verses, Acts 15:8-9, stating they mean everyone has been given authority, “lay” people and God’s chosen leader of the Church, Peter who was speaking in those verses. Then a few posts later stating those two verses mean something totally different! Was it, the person realized he was going to be called on hist first interpretation.
If everyone decided the meaning of Scripture, there would
be so many opinions causing constant division. That’s why
God chose one authority.
A sentence in the latest message given non-Catholic Christian seer, Priscilla Van Sutphin.
The in parenthesis, the “still” means those who follow God after the Great Warning, Protestants hear the Great Warning called “the awakening” in prophecy. One end time people.
May 29, 2012
“Can you see how many are now speaking the same? My body is coming to more maturity and they will be speaking the same things, [those that are willing to still follow ME ].”
http://ft111.com/priscilla.htm
‘And when tradition and Scripture conflict it will always be tradition that is favored”...
~ ~ ~
Martin Luther’s “Bible Alone” is a heresy. Way to go~@! You are coming along admitting there is tradition.
Go further, realize you accept some tradition. Don’t take it so personal, you didn’t break away from the Church, you are following what you’ve been taught.
CynicalBear:
“Do you always talk about people behind their back?”
~ ~ ~
(i.e. does not “make it personal”)
You said don’t make it personal. The above is slam directed at me, that’s personal, not kind at all.
Admit you’re Catholic, it would show people reading this thread, you are fair.
Another huge surprise! A noob on the RF banging on a mod. That always turns out swell.
I've always acknowledged the existence and following of a number of traditions by Christians. Some good, some not.
“Martin Luther’s “Bible Alone” is a heresy”
Whether it is or not Marty will have to answer for not me since I don't follow him.
“Go further, realize you accept some tradition. Don’t take it so personal, you didn’t break away from the Church, you are following what you’ve been taught.”
No, I didn't “break away from the Church”, “the Church” broke away from the Christian church and became an apostate organ of the Roman state.
“you are following what you’ve been taught.”
That's one of the nicest things anyone has ever said to me!
I think I may be getting a case of the vapors here or am I just blushing?
Our discussion is proving “private judgment” is heresy. You stated in a past couple of posts two interpretations of Acts 15:8-9. Your FIRST, interpretation...”lay” people have the same authority as Peter and the Apostles. That’s not what those verses are about. Besides, there is no teaching from Christ that everyone has the authority to interpret Scripture. Multiple interpretations result in a house divided, PIOS does not come from God.
Today ~ CynicalBear:
“Don’t give me that error from the CC that Peter was the leader. If he was it would have been him who made the final decision.”
Look at all the verses, the ones preceeding Acts 15:8-9 and the ones to follow.
~ ~ ~
Acts 15:7
And when there had been much disputing, Peter, rising up, said to them: Men, brethren, you know, that in former days GOD made choice among us, that BY MY MOUTH the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
“Remember that Scripture must support Scripture, and since Scripture clearly demonstrates Peter’s primacy the Council of Jerusalem must be read in that context. So when you read Scripture you must ask yourself not only what is the author saying but also illustrating in the text.
First, what is the council deciding? Whether or not the gentiles should be circumcised. Okay, what next, after much debate, Peter stands up and addresses the assembly. Now think about that; if James was the authority why would Peter stand and speak first? Why you might ask? One, Peter has primacy over the apostles bestowed upon him by Christ. Two, Peter is always mentioned first among the apostles in Scripture indicating his primacy. Three, the writer wants to be congruent with the rest of Scripture and show that Peter is mentioned first.
Now here’s the key part. What is the first sentence that Peter says? Pay close attention now. He says from the earliest days God chose HIM, among the rest of the apostles, to covert the Gentiles. So the gentiles were entrusted to Peter by God. Since the gentiles were entrusted to Peter by God the gentiles are Peters domain. It is Peter’s prerogative then, to decide what is to be done with them, and that is what happens. Peter stands up and tells everyone what should be done. Then there was silence. Paul and Barnabas spoke about the signs and wonders that God worked through them. Then JAMES being the BISHOP OF JERUSELEM wholeheartedly agrees with Peter’s initial decision. When James says , “I judge therefore,” he is not invoking supreme authority over Peter. He’s actually saying “I am firmly of the opinion therefore”. Hope that helps”
“No, I didn’t “break away from the Church”, “the Church” broke away from the Christian church and became an apostate organ of the Roman state.”
~ ~ ~
I am sorry CYC, the above is false. HISTORY shows and the
famous major science tested MIRACLES are more proof the RCC is the Church Jesus established.
“The Christian Church”...kinda vague. The Roman Catholic
Church canonized Scripture. Without her God given authority you would not have a Bible to quote from...that’s a basic everyone must finally come to accept.
God wants us all to believe the same. What did He just
say in the message to Priscilla Van Sutphin, a Protestant
messenger?
Drives me crazy, ignoring their own prophets.
Admit you’re Catholic, it would show people reading this thread, you are fair.
“Another huge surprise! A noob on the RF banging on a mod. That always turns out swell.”
~ ~ ~
It seems unfair, personal insults are allowed by some people in this thread. I asked a question to figure out why.
“Banging” is a very uncouth term, why did you choose it?
So to you and you alone I say good nite.
Non-Catholics are posting quotes and comments about Augustine, Polycarp, Irenaeus, etc.
These men believed in the Real Presence, how come their
words to show their belief in the Eucharist are ignored?
I can share a couple of their quotes. Believe in the
Eucharist and all misunderstandings about the faith will
be straightened out. Go for the pinnacle.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.