Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: dsrtsage; guitarplayer1953; boatbums; All
From the article: Long before our God began his creations, he dwelt on a mortal world like ours, one of the creations that his Father had created for him and his brethren.

By the way, who then created god? (Dsrtsage, post #4)

Ok so God had a father and I'd suppose that His Father had a Father too. So how far back into eternity does this go? And what happened to the Father's Father? [Guitarplayer1953, post #8]

[Excellent Q, btw, re: "what happened to the Father's Father?"]

At what point in Mormonology was the "first cause". How, and WHO, started it all from nothing? [boatbums, post #12]

Let us "venture" into the deep Occultic "gospel" of Joseph Smith as he wove his fanciful narrative on this:

Smith excerpt #1:
In the beginning, the head of the Gods called a council of the Gods; and they came together and concocted a plan to create the world and people it. (Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 5, 1844)

Whatever Lds lamely claim about Smith's worldview of time as it pertains to the gods, we know Smith believed in a "beginning" that was operative before the Mormon plan to the create this world. [My question pertaining to this quote -- to add to the other Qs asked above -- is, who's the head of the Gods here? Do Mormons worship him? (If not, why not?)]

Smith excerpt #2:
In the very beginning the Bible shows there is a plurality of Gods beyond the power of refutation. It is a great subject I am dwelling on. The word Eloheim ought to be in the plural all the way through--Gods. The heads of the Gods appointed ONE God for us... (Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 372)

According to Smith's worldview, "the heads of the Gods appointed one God for us." [Why, how nice, Mormons: You worship a god chosen by a bureaucracy at a committee meeting!]

So tell us, Mormons...this "god" who was chosen. Here, Smith is making a BIG deal about Eloheim=plurality of gods. Yet, Smith doesn't go on and say that "the heads of the Gods appointed a godhead for us." He very specifically says these heads of Gods appointed "ONE GOD" for us. I mean, what, Lds? Some of you pretend to be Mormon apologists & yet you can't answer this? Don't they teach this in Seminary or Institute or Sunday School classes? If not, why not?]

Conclusion: Whatever "time frame" or eternity frame Mormons want to buy into, only ONE GOD was chosen by a plurality of gods. It doesn't say a plurality of gods was chosen by a plurality of gods. Therefore, at that earth-making decision, no Mormon godhead existed!!! Apparently, that developed "later."

Smith excerpt #3: I will go back to the beginning, before the world was, to show what kind of a being God is. What sort of a being was God in the beginning? Open your ears and hear, all ye ends of the earth; for I am going to prove it to you by the Bible, and to tell you the designs of God in relation to the human race, and why he interferes with the affairs of man. God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted Man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens. That is the great secret. (Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 3, 1844)

Again, whatever Mormons want to say is the Alpha point...Smith says the Mormon god was a man. That he "was once as we are now." We already know from the above quote that the godhead came even after the Mormon god was appointed. Certainly, the Mormon god was no "godhead" as a boy wonder.

Smith excerpt #4: I learned a testimony concerning Abraham, and he reasoned concerning tghe Gods of heaven. '...Intelligences exist one above another, so that there is no end to them.' If Abraham reasoned thus--If Jesus Christ was the Son of God, and John discovered that God the Father of Jesus Christ had a Father, you may suppose that He had a Father also. Where was there ever a son without a father? And where was there ever a father without first being a son? Whenever did a tree or anything spring into existence without a progenitor? And everything comes in this way. Paul says that which is earthly is in the likeness of that which is heavenly. Hence if Jesus had a Father, can we not believe that He had a Father also? I despise the idea of being scared to death at such a doctrine, for the Bible is full of it. I want you to pay particular attention to what I am saying. Jesus said that the Father wrought precisely in the same way as His Father had done before Him. As the Father had done before? He laid down His life, and took it up the same as His Father had done before. (Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 373)

Do you understand, Mormons, the magnitude of what's being said here? First, Smith said there's no end to one intelligence having been above another -- the teaching of infinite regression of gods. Then Smith is claiming that Jesus had a grandpa and great-grandpa: [Note after the first elipse below, no content has been removed]
...John discovered that God the Father of Jesus Christ
had a Father, [Jesus' grandpa on His Father's side]
you may suppose that He had a Father also. [Jesus' great-grandpa on His Father's side]

Finally, Smith claims that God the Father also laid down His life in some sort of redemptive way. Which means whatever "time" you want to leave undefined, DU, apparently God the Father had time enough to live as a man and die as a man for some whole other world.

Apostle Pratt showing us what he learned from either Smith or from the Mormon god:
We were begotten by our Father in Heaven; the person of our Father in Heaven was begotten on a previous heavenly world by His Father;
and again, He was begotten by a still more ancient Father,
and so on, from generation to generation, from one heavenly world to another still more ancient, until our minds are wearied and lost in the multiplicity of generations and successive worlds,

and as a last resort, we wonder in our minds, how far back the genealogy extends, and how the first world was formed, and the first father was begotten. But why does man seek for a first, when revelation informs him that God's works are without beginning? (Lds "apostle" Orson Pratt, The Seer, p. 132, 1853)

Ah, wearied Mormon minds, says the G-G grandfather of Mitt Romney. (And some want "weary mind" squared -- Mitt Romney -- to become THE leader of the free world???)

17 posted on 04/09/2012 11:11:37 PM PDT by Colofornian ( Tell us: Why do we want to vote for ONE socialist to defeat ANOTHER socialist again?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies ]


To: Colofornian
"Eloheim=plurality"

The plurality of God is speaking of the God-head. Let us make man in our image. God has set up spiritual laws for man that He also must adhere to. By that I mean God has established that in the mouth or tow or more a fact is established one can not bring charges against another without a second witness. So it is the same of God and the HS and Christ. Three witnesses inside the God-head proclaiming one another. In Genesis's it says that God spoke and everything came into being the HS brooded over the waters and in the NT it says that in Him and by Him all things were created by Christ Jesus. One and the same three yet one.

104 posted on 04/10/2012 4:43:59 PM PDT by guitarplayer1953 (Grammar & spelling maybe wrong, get over it, the world will not come to an end!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson