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To: BenKenobi; daniel1212; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; ...
So that being said. Leave and cleave, apparently isn’t the doctrine of anyone but the Catholic church. The Catholic church preaches that cleave - means that the two become one and not two. Barrier methods of contraception are just that, a barrier - rather than 2 becoming one, you have 2 remaining 2. You are not really cleaving - you are holding back. Out of fear perhaps? I do not know.

Are you joking?!?!?!

From the church that hands out *annulments* even to those who've had children???

I don't know of any other denomination that offers church sanctioned divorce in disguise.

Besides, the two becoming one flesh was never predicated in Scripture on having children. Even without children, when the marriage is consummated, the two have become one flesh. It's more than just a physical union.

Otherwise you're saying that a marriage that doesn't produce children means the husband and wife are not *one flesh*.

517 posted on 01/06/2012 3:03:39 AM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

“From the church that hands out *annulments* even to those who’ve had children???”

Do you understand what an annulment is? You’re an ex-Catholic. Can you define what annulment means?

“I don’t know of any other denomination that offers church sanctioned divorce in disguise.”

That’s because it’s not ‘church sanctioned divorce’.

And BTW the Anglicans were FOUNDED on ‘church sanctioned divorce’.

“Besides, the two becoming one flesh was never predicated in Scripture on having children.”

Two becoming one flesh has to do with the union of husband and wife in marriage. Contraception impairs this union, because you are putting something between husband and wife.

“Even without children, when the marriage is consummated, the two have become one flesh. It’s more than just a physical union.”

Never argued to the contrary. But the physical union must be there and contraception impairs this union.

“Otherwise you’re saying that a marriage that doesn’t produce children means the husband and wife are not *one flesh*.”

Not what I’ve been saying at all. There is a distinction between choosing not to have children and between inability to have children.


528 posted on 01/06/2012 7:05:59 AM PST by BenKenobi
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