Which Came First: The Church or the New Testament?

Orthodoxinfo.com ^ | by Fr. James Bernstein

[Religion Moderator]

willingly

Reading the mind of another Freeper is a form of "making it personal."

Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.

[count-your-change]

And with the claim of having written the Bible comes the inevitable claim of having the authority to say whether one may read what Bible translation and under what circumstances.

“In general, the Church has always allowed the reading of the Bible in the vernacular, if it was desirable for the spiritual needs of her children; she has forbidden it only when it was almost certain to cause serious spiritual harm.”
(Catholic Encyclopedia, Scriptures)

Ah...the good old days of the Index...

[mitch5501]

Galatians 4:17 - They zealously affect you, but not well; yea, they would exclude you, that ye might affect them.

New International Version (©1984) Those people are zealous to win you over, but for no good. What they want is to alienate you [from us], so that you may be zealous for them.

New Living Translation (©2007) Those false teachers are so eager to win your favor, but their intentions are not good. They are trying to shut you off from me so that you will pay attention only to them.

English Standard Version (©2001) They make much of you, but for no good purpose. They want to shut you out, that you may make much of them.

New American Standard Bible (©1995) They eagerly seek you, not commendably, but they wish to shut you out so that you will seek them.

[caww]

Understood.

[presently no screen name]

God’s Holy Spirit inspired Word is the ONLY authority - the FINAL authority for His Children - Children of Light.

Anyone who believes otherwise are children of darkness. Satan is the counterfeiter. And any ‘church’ or organization who instituted man made teachings belong to satan’s and his kingdom. For he is the master of lies/deception.

There is ONLY ONE WAY, ONE TRUTH and ONE LIFE - JESUS, THE WORD. And the children of Light follow Jesus ALONE.

[Iscool]

That church, BTW, which we are ALL members of who have received Jesus Christ.

And of course we did not receive Jesus by eating a cracker...And that's the only way the Catholics receive the Christ...

By the bible definition they are not even Christians yet they still claim that THEY are the church...

Ignorance with hubris...

[Iscool]

“In general, the Church has always allowed the reading of the Bible in the vernacular, if it was desirable for the spiritual needs of her children; she has forbidden it only when it was almost certain to cause serious spiritual harm.”

Don't read the words of God...They are sure to mess you up, if you are a Mormon, a Muzlimaniac or a Catholic...

Now who do you suppose would give Catholics the advice to not read the words of God???

[metmom]

Now who do you suppose would give Catholics the advice to not read the words of God???

I love rhetorical questions.....

[presently no screen name]

and Rome had nothing whatsoever to do with that.

Satan used Rome to kill Jesus. And the Vatican/CC models themselves in more ways than headdress and clothing of Rome but empire, marble, setting up one man to rule this earthly kingdom w/decrees, satan's kingdom.

But, alas, satan didn't know The Word - because it's Holy Spirit discerned - that Jesus came to earth to die. So satan is now deceiving those who Jesus died for with man made teachings and commands for his earthly kingdom - which is the wide road to eternal destruction.

[caww]

The more learned about Catholicism the more one understands that long ago they left the path Jesus intended and to this day increasingly add to and subject it’s membership to the false teachings Jesus warned us about. Nothings basically changed....just another face put on it that makes it more palitable to this era we now live, as all false teachings say and do.

However, I do believe most of the membership have a true belief they are on the right path...because many simply do not understand the teachings, source of and or do not know Gods word enough to see their own error. Their ultimate faith rests on the Vatican, Pope and it’s teachings....and for that they have missed the mark and the High calling which is in Christ Jesus alone...not the VAticans false teachings.

[presently no screen name]

A true belief would know God knows best - His Word, not man made teachings. A true belief does not pray to the dead. Prayer is worship - that is why Jesus taught us to pray to Our Father. They don’t have a true belief only what they are taught - man made teachings. They may want it but are not seeking HIM ALONE; otherwise they would find it. They seek man. They are taking a lackadaisical attitude with the most important area in their life because they think they have it because that’s what deception is telling them.

[presently no screen name]

Scripture goes out of it’s way to tell us that tradition is authoritative.

God's Word IS THE ONLY Authority, the FINAL Authority. You better check what you're reading. Garbage in, garbage out.

It's ALL about Jesus, THE WORD.

[CynicalBear]

>>I use Bible Gateway for an easy to use index, and you can get ANY version you want. There are preferences that you can set for yourself. It has a very easy to use keyword search feature.<<

I use those as well. They are great resource tools for anyone who truly wants to find the truth of scripture. The Greek and Hebrew interlinear are especially illuminating. The subtle word changes or insertions in some versions of the Bible that many people use are particularly disturbing. I have discovered that fully trusting anyone after the Apostle John wrote Revelation is risky at best. The admonition of Paul to “search the scriptures daily” is wise counsel.

[presently no screen name]

You have already submitted yourselves to infalliable Rome, for you bind yourselves to the book she has written.

That's the claws are catholicsm reaching out to bring in the more for satan's kingdom through deception.

And here is what Jesus has to say about that..
"I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; NO ONE can snatch them out of My Hand". John 10:28

[smvoice]

Thank you for the information. I am doing a study right now on the Faith OF Christ. (Gal.2:16; 2:20), as differs from Faith IN Christ. “OF” and “IN” sounds different and I want to see if there is a difference in the Greek for those two words. It doesn’t sound like a big difference, but the meanings would be very different. That is, what IS the Faith OF Christ? We know what Faith IN Christ is. Just an interesting small study, I think..

[CynicalBear]

>>That is, what IS the Faith OF Christ?<<

That is vital. With Christ in us the faith OF Christ sustains us not our feeble human faith. We appear before the Father clothed in the righteousness of Christ not our own righteousness.

[count-your-change]

“Now who do you suppose would give Catholics the advice to not read the words of God???”

1 Tim. 4:1-3 suggests an answer.

[metmom]

“In general, the Church has always allowed the reading of the Bible in the vernacular, if it was desirable for the spiritual needs of her children; she has forbidden it only when it was almost certain to cause serious spiritual harm.” (Catholic Encyclopedia, Scriptures)

Ah...the good old days of the Index...

Reading the Word can cause *spiritual harm*? Who knew?

Are they serious?

Who in their right mind could even consider that reading the inspired, Holy Spirit breathed, Word of the living God could cause spiritual harm?

The other option, of course is to not read the inspired, Holy Spirit breathed, Word of the living God. And that would NOT cause spiritual harm?

The depth of the deception of the enemy is staggering.

[CynicalBear]

>>The depth of the deception of the enemy is staggering.<<

That’s an undisputed fact. Even today the “allowed” versions of the RCC contain subtle changes from the original Greek and Hebrew.

[metmom]

God's Word IS THE ONLY Authority, the FINAL Authority.

Scripture is God breathed.

It is God giving His thoughts to us. When we read Scripture we are reading God's thoughts. When we memorize and meditate on Scripture, we are thinking God's thoughts.

Small wonder that when you hide God's word in your heart, it can keep you from sin.

Psalm 1:1-3 1 Blessed is the man who walks not in the counsel of the wicked, nor stands in the way of sinners, nor sits in the seat of scoffers; 2 but his delight is in the law of the LORD, and on his law he meditates day and night.

3 He is like a tree planted by streams of water that yields its fruit in its season, and its leaf does not wither. In all that he does, he prospers.