Believers in Jesus Christ.....
Gnostics, Arians, Nestorians, LDS, Monarchists all say they are believers in Jesus Christ. "Believers in Jesus Christ" according to whom?
according to God's written Word
Can't count the wide variety, from Oneness Pentecostals and other Modalists to Unitarian Messianic Jews who would lecture both you and I on what God's written word says - and it's not the same Jesus or God we believe in. "According to God's written word" according to whom?
which clearly speaks of Him as our "counselor"...our "guide" and of whom we can rely on without question.
How can all these interpretations of the same scriptures relying on the same guide end up in radically different beliefs about who God is? "Guided" to what according to whom?
All authority is given Him as you know.
Same question. If He is our common authority, why does the same authority claim such different beliefs? It doesn't. It can't possibly.
Why so hard for you to grasp?
Because it is so obviously not true; if it were true the question "according to whom" would be meaningless; we would all agree based on the same scripture, the same guide and the same ultimate authority.
But we do not. It is a dysfunctional proposition to begin with. It never worked, can never work for His Church, One, Holy and Universal in its belief.
This alone should make plain that it is not what Christ intended. It is also not what His Apostles instituted and not what we see in scripture.
thanks for your reply.
I was just getting around to reading this thread and see that the discussion has degraded from the joyous news of the triumph of Christianity to "whose" Christianity is better/real/true.
What I believe is more important than a nameplate on a church door is the common faith that binds us all into the one body of Jesus Christ. Back in the first century the people who came to saving faith in Jesus Christ met regularly to edify and encourage each other as well as sharing of food, ensuring no one went without. It was a cohesive group held together by the common faith of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who died and rose again to save us from our sins. These people also shared a deep and abiding love for each other that was sorely tested by their common persecution from the Roman overlords.
The Apostles taught the truths as Jesus taught them and also the additional truths he revealed to them through the Holy Spirit after his ascension. The Apostles discipled others and established those who had gifts to teach and pastor the fledgling local groups that were springing up like wildfire. Because they could not worship openly, they met in private homes, in catacombs, anywhere they could. These elders/leaders trained and discipled others and the "church" grew as local congregations were set up and evangelists brought more and more into the Body of Christ.
When the Apostles knew that Jesus was not coming back immediately, the Holy Spirit inspired them to enscripturate all that believers should be taught - and they had the Old Testament as their example. As the leading Apostles wrote their epistles and copies were made and circulated among the spread out churches along with the life and teachings of Jesus while he was there, the New Testament was being formed and a collection of them was used to continue to teach the true faith long after the Apostles were gone.
Of course, many millenia have gone by and the "church" is now numbered in the billions of people. There are vast numbers of local churches with many differing with each other as to method of worship, leadership structure and differences in certain theologies. But, regardless of the name of the particular institution or organization, the one binding unity should be the same faith in Jesus Christ as Son of God who died and rose again to save us from our sins. THAT is what binds all Christians and what makes any person a member in the one body of Christ.
When I think of this time of year, with so many different customs and traditions surrounding the birth of our Savior, I really hope we can put aside our differences and concentrate on the one unifying truth we share - Jesus.
For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life." (Jn. 3:16)
You just aren’t getting it D-Fender.....and I say this with respect of you...but...you remind me of the deciples when Jesus time and again let them know he was going to die and they just didn’t get it, even though He used scripture still they didn’t get it.
Some things are simply a matter of faith in Christ...yet you keep asking “according to whom?”.....I believe possible your looking for earthly confirmation when He himself wants to confirm what you believe...just as he did with his deciples. You seem to want mans authority...earthly authority,... when our God is not of this earth...He is Spirit and not limited by an organization or leadership of.
the Lord knows exactly how to bring his truths to us ‘individually’......even though you say that’s not the way it should go...it is the way he operates when we need the assurances or clarification which can only come from Him.
Yes it gets very personal....and it should...even Jesus told Peter that man had not revealed to Him that he was the Christ.
You seem to want the catholic church to be THEE church....well maybe it should be for you for reasons you alone know....but for others we choose differently....no different than the churches in Revelations and people who went to various ones then...each had it’s own problems and were at various levels of understanding of the things of God....but they all had their foundations in Christ Jesus...He is the authority according to Him.
Nearly two thousand years have gone by since Jesus prayed that we would be one, and you can’t even find us being one in one church, let alone in all of Christendom. ....So it says to me, as Jesus reminded us in the Lord’s Prayer,... that I need to pray much more about my relationship with God and my understanding of his kingdom...it isn’t about the church ...it’s about our relationship with Him and understanding that is the lens in which we see the church.