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In the Spirit: Can a Catholic also be a liberal?
Wisconsin State Journal ^
| November 27, 2011
| DOUG ERICKSON
Posted on 11/29/2011 4:33:50 AM PST by jacknhoo
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To: Alex Murphy
People have been crossing borders “illegally” since there were orders to cross. For instance, in the Proclamation of 1763, the King forbade Colonists to occupy the Indian lands west of the Appalachians. They went ahead and did so. Instances could be multiplied. So far as universal health care is concerned, this goal is quite legitimate in itself. Only the means are in dispute. Thirdly, so you think labor unions are evil in themselves? Are the kind that supports the ultra kind who supports the most rapacious sort of capitalism, including the sweat shops of China?
61
posted on
11/29/2011 9:23:08 PM PST
by
RobbyS
(Viva Christus Rex.)
To: campaignPete R-CT
"This is often not true. Many "pro-choice" office holders are allies of the pro-family movement and have a pro-life voting record and support traditional marriage."
If a pro-choice office holder publicly claims they are pro-choice they are in mortal sin. Regardless of your personal opinion and regardless of their voting record or allies - this is the Catholic dogma - this is the law...not your secular humanist perspective expressed in your response. We are talking Catholics, here, or did you miss that part?
Regarding your authorization statement...simply ridiculous.
62
posted on
11/30/2011 3:21:21 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: fruser1
"Even though I am against abortion, I can understand how a Catholic politician could vote to allow its legality."
I am in agreement with that statement, because I can understand how they can vote to allow the legality of murdering defenseless innocent little pre-born boys and girls...God's gifts - Free Will to commit mortal sin and be excommunicated. They will to adhere to error. It is as simple as that. Anyone who believe they are not in mortal sin and excommunicated is a heretic...and a formal heretic at that, because every Catholic knows the truth that the Church teaches on pro-abortion politicians and on abortion itself. And anyone who follows a heretic is a heretic himself.
Canon 1325, 1917 Code of Canon Law: After the reception of baptism, if anyone, retaining the name Christian, pertinaciously denies or doubts something to be believed from the truth of divine and Catholic faith, is a heretic.
63
posted on
11/30/2011 3:52:56 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: Alex Murphy
Amen! I don't think that can be said loudly enough! Congratulations on saying really dumb things really loudly then.
No political position taken by the USCCB on an issue like immigration is ever binding in conscience on the Catholic faithful. It's a matter of prudential judgement.
But more to the point, is your ultimate loyalty to Jesus Christ, or to your country? Are you capable of admitting that your country may, at some point, be diametrically opposed to God, to his Christ, to his Kingdom, and to the Gospel?
Someone who doesn't believe that the Catholic Church is founded by Christ for the salvation of the world should not be a Catholic under any circumstances. Someone who does believe that, but remains outside the Church because they think it endorses policies which will "destroy his nation" condemns his soul to eternal hellfire. It's really as simple as that.
A nation can be made into an idol just like anything else, Alex. When your nation starts telling you that its survival necessitates dehumanizing Catholics (or Jews, or anyone else), herding them into concentration camps, and killing them ... to what will your "devotion" be then?
In 1937, Pius XI told the Catholics of Germany:
Whoever exalts race, or the people, or the State, or a particular form of State, or the depositories of power, or any other fundamental value of the human community - however necessary and honorable be their function in worldly things - whoever raises these notions above their standard value and divinizes them to an idolatrous level, distorts and perverts an order of the world planned and created by God; he is far from the true faith in God and from the concept of life which that faith upholds. -- Mit Brennender Sorge, March 14, 1937
64
posted on
11/30/2011 5:39:35 AM PST
by
Campion
("It is in the religion of ignorance that tyranny begins." -- Franklin)
To: Campion
A nation can be made into an idol just like anything else, Alex. When your nation starts telling you that its survival necessitates dehumanizing Catholics (or Jews, or anyone else), herding them into concentration camps, and killing them ... to what will your "devotion" be then?[In 1933] The Vatican was so appreciative of being recognized as a full partner that it asked God to bless the Reich. On a more practical level, it ordered German bishops to swear allegiance to the National Socialist regime. The new oath concluded with these significant words: "In the performance of my spiritual office and in my solicitude for the welfare and the interest of the German Reich, I will endeaver to avoid all detrimental acts which might endanger it."
from the thread The Catholic Church and Nazi Germany: an exhaustive survey of John Toland's biography of Hitler
65
posted on
11/30/2011 6:05:53 AM PST
by
Alex Murphy
(http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2703506/posts?page=518#518)
To: jacknhoo
In the Spirit: Can a Catholic also be a liberal?
A Catholic can become brain dead. So it's understandable that a Catholic could become a liberal.
66
posted on
11/30/2011 6:07:13 AM PST
by
aruanan
To: Campion
Cracks me up how it never actually answered any of your direct questions. Great points, Campion.
To: jacknhoo
so a grown man buggering a little boy is just a “sin of weakness.” Got it.
To: strider44
Reading is a skill. Get it.
To: strider44
Go on back to sleep...sorry to have awakened you from your coma.
70
posted on
11/30/2011 6:27:54 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: Alex Murphy
I wonder, why did you leave the Episcopal Church, Alex, and what religion or denomination or sect or cult are you a member of now?
71
posted on
11/30/2011 6:34:09 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: jacknhoo
I wonder, why did you leave the Episcopal Church, Alex, and what religion or denomination or sect or cult are you a member of now?Why spend time wondering? Posts by Alex Murphy
72
posted on
11/30/2011 6:45:56 AM PST
by
Alex Murphy
(http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2703506/posts?page=518#518)
To: Zippo44
"A church that endorses policies that will destroy my nation is not worthy of my devotion."
Perhaps therein lies the problem, Alex...your devotion lies in this world. You are not of this world. Persecution for your nation will gain you nothing.
73
posted on
11/30/2011 6:58:13 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: Alex Murphy
I have no interest in reading all of your comments on this site and attempting to deduce the answer, Alex. Apparently, you don’t want to answer the question...that’s fine.
74
posted on
11/30/2011 7:03:14 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: jacknhoo
so what is your point about the pro-choice state legislators? We should get rid of them all? And replace them with whom?
75
posted on
11/30/2011 7:48:27 AM PST
by
campaignPete R-CT
(I will go back to New Hampshire to campaign.)
To: campaignPete R-CT
"so what is your point about the pro-choice state legislators?"
They are in grave sin if they publicly state their error or practice their error and should seek reconciliation, regardless of their religious beliefs or lack thereof, this still holds true. Just because someone believes error or perceives evil as being good, does not make them correct and does not change what is truth.
"We should get rid of them all?"
That would go a long way toward bringing God's graces upon this republic once again. Also, a truly pro-life politician could never embrace atheistic socialism/Marxism/communism...because they would realize atheism denies the sanctity and dignity of human life. So, yes, we "should" get rid of them. A Catholic is forbidden to vote for them. Catholics who vote for them are in grave sin and should seek reconciliation, regardless of their "personal" religious beliefs (they should submit) or lack thereof, this still holds true. Just because someone believes error, or perceives evil as being good, does not make them correct and does not change what is the truth as revealed.
"And replace them with whom?"
Pro-Life state legislators, of course.
It would only take a short amount of time for all political parties to run/endorse pro-life candidates, if Americans insisted only pro-life candidates were to be voted for. I have a feeling this is not too far off...God has had enough with this republic's deathculture and is ready to give us some of His unfathomable Divine Mercy.
76
posted on
11/30/2011 8:48:41 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: jacknhoo
you cannot replace these legislators who vote with the pro-family agenda because
1. there is no such pro-life person in the district who is in a position to run successfully and serve in the office. Only make believe people that exist in your head. You would have to come up with a real name.
2. There are no pro-life activists to raise money and do the campaign work. There are not enough pro-life donors.
3. There is no pro-life media to get the message out and very few pro-life voters.
Other than that, no problem. That is why if pro-family people in liberal states have legislators that vote with us even if they are not nominally pro-life ... they try to keep them in office so that they are not replaced by progressive leftists.
If the best possible person living in the district is already the state rep, and you replaced him, you would obviously get somebody worse.
77
posted on
11/30/2011 9:20:23 AM PST
by
campaignPete R-CT
(I will go back to New Hampshire to campaign.)
To: campaignPete R-CT
If Pro-Life people refused to vote for a pro-choice candidate, the pro-choice candidates would win only one election. As soon as people realize that Pro-Life (the majority of voters) are putting their foot down and refuse to vote for pro-choice, Pro-Life people will step up to claim that popularity and they will win against any pro-choice candidate.
More Americans Pro-Life Than Pro-Choice for First Time (first time since 1995)
http://www.gallup.com/poll/118399/more-americans-pro-life-than-pro-choice-first-time.aspx
78
posted on
11/30/2011 9:46:33 AM PST
by
jacknhoo
(Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
To: jacknhoo
i guess if you convince 100,000 pro-lifers to move from GA to CT ... you would be correct.
There are very few “pro-life voters” in Conn. or throughout the northeast. And there are 5 times as many radical activists.
So how ‘bout we send 100,000 radicals down to GA and you send 100,000 pro-lifers up here?
Pro-life voters are people who consistently show up and vote for pro-life candidates. Consistently show up! Less than 2% of the population in CT. You need 50% to have a majority.
79
posted on
11/30/2011 9:58:23 AM PST
by
campaignPete R-CT
(I will go back to New Hampshire to campaign.)
To: jacknhoo
Less than 40% of American adults voted last NOV. So there are more non-voters than voters.
80
posted on
11/30/2011 10:01:27 AM PST
by
campaignPete R-CT
(I will go back to New Hampshire to campaign.)
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