Posted on 09/02/2011 9:07:47 AM PDT by marshmallow
Couldn’t handle the rest of that post?
“Moody is a revivalist school and would not contenance anyone on their faculty with that belief. It would be contrary to their statement of faith.”
So you say. Should I believe you or the guy who got the edited and reveiwed article published in a Protestant publication?
Let me see if I have this straight......
We are given a choice between believing b-d or believing your recollection of an article in a publication of which you don't recall the name, by an author you haven't identified, edited by someone who you also have not identified.
Given those options I would have done the same as Vlad.
Since when is stating that it’s not possible to definitively say who wrote Hebrews means that I don’t believe part of the Bible is inspired?
How you get from here to there is beyond me because there is no logical connection between your premise and conclusion.
When/if you get an answer, I would love to know it. It makes absolutely no sense.
“Well, I no longer remember the publication,”
Why should anyone believe your libel? If you can’t cite the source than your statement is worthless; much like the authority of an unnamed or anonymous source.
When one slanders an institution like Moody one should have the integrity to at least cite the source of the calumny.
I think this section does a good job of explaining that thought:
Ephesians 4:10-13
Amplified Bible (AMP)
10 He Who descended is the [very] same as He Who also has ascended high above all the heavens, that He [His presence] might fill all things (the whole universe, from the lowest to the highest).
11 And His gifts were [varied; He Himself appointed and gave men to us] some to be apostles (special messengers), some prophets (inspired preachers and expounders), some evangelists (preachers of the Gospel, traveling missionaries), some pastors (shepherds of His flock) and teachers.
12 His intention was the perfecting and the full equipping of the saints (His consecrated people), [that they should do] the work of ministering toward building up Christ's body (the church),
13 [That it might develop] until we all attain oneness in the faith and in the comprehension of the [[a]full and accurate] knowledge of the Son of God, that [we might arrive] at really mature manhood (the completeness of personality which is nothing less than the standard height of Christ's own perfection), the measure of the stature of the fullness of the Christ and the completeness found in Him.
Well we know this is often the case with islam...and in many of the cults they can actually threaten and make life pretty uncomfortable...Scientology is another..once you're in and rise thru the rank and file it is difficult to leave..enormous pressure and threats depending on how much you know. And even after you leave the pressure and threats can continue.
But even with lessor extremes there's a large degree of pressure...usually in the form of guilt manipulation....and such as... "you wouldn't be leaving if you truly understood and believed" sort of thing. Or that you were never "one of us to begin with"..and the list goes on but generally along those lines.
The worst of course is that within the body of believers of some churches who might tell another they are sinning if they leave and denying Christ.
You wrote:
“What other sources did Paul suggest to use?”
St. Paul himself learned from Christ and the Church. He already knew the scriptures - the Old Testament - and yet had been a Christ denier. Have you ever read 1 Corinthians 11:23? Apparently not. And you clearly have no clue about 2 Thessalonians 2:15 and 2 Thessalonians 3:6.
You wrote:
“We are given a choice between believing b-d or...”
No. Claiming that no one would ever do what in fact was done just because of a statement of faith that profs would be expected to adhere to is simply silly. It is the height of idealist based denial. There’s simply no reason to ignore these cases: http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2008/aprilweb-only/114-24.0.html
http://www.rasmusen.org/x/2005/03/01/professor-fired-for-heresy-at-huntington-college/
I’m allergic to amplified Bibles maybe in something like the way some are allergic to Magisteria.
But this actually does not seem bad. I’m glad s/he/they agree with my sense of how Paul was using perfect.
It seems to me that if this does not suggest it ad least admits to the possibility of the “perfected” saint sharing in the work of Christ. In some sense, of course, we will always be passive recipients. But we also are called to be givers. Both the call and answering it are gifts, yet there is that “willing heart.”
Great verse! His intention clear in this verse...as well His desired results.
I have often been downcaste these past years as churches have often resorted to becomming "community centers" with everything from bookstores to cafe's, and this often at the expense of "equipping" the saints. Somehow the two should be able to work hand in hand but all to often the social aspect becomes the center of the agenda and solid teaching holds few willing to take the time for.
You wrote:
“Why should anyone believe your libel?”
When you conclusively prove it’s a libel, I’ll address that question.
“If you can’t cite the source than your statement is worthless; much like the authority of an unnamed or anonymous source.”
I’m not worried about your assessment. Since you’re a Protestant anti-Catholic I would not expect you to admit or recognize the truth no matter how conclusive the evidence presented.
“When one slanders an institution like Moody one should have the integrity to at least cite the source of the calumny.”
Well, as I already mentioned, I don’t remember the Protestant author or the Protestant publication so I won’t be posting that info soon. I guess you’ll just have to fume uselessly. I am also not slandering any institution, but your opinion on the subject is completely unimportant to me. Clearly you’re annoyed. That’s fine with me. I won’t lose any sleep over any of this.
Moody is very dear to me for it was thru one of their Pastors I came to know the Lord. Not to mention families which followed as they too came to know Him.
This pastor was retired to our community and yet His work moved many to the Lord...and they in turn led others. Fabulous work...and good solid teaching with him. The Lord will surely welcome him home when his time comes for his life touched many and many were saved....one on one as he went. Amazing man fully yielded to the Lord Jesus.
boatbums, I am very sorry if I hurt your feelings.
Your post did not name Catholicism but since this is basically an anti-Catholic thread how else was I to take it? It felt that way to me.
I was honestly wanting to know your belief on OSAS. I was a Protestant for 61 years of my life. Unbaptized. I became a Catholic because God led me to the church.
This is why I am not here very often. I don’t want hurt anyone but I also get very, very, tired of my belief in God and Jesus Christ to be so often seen as an occasion of amusement to others. All because of my sincere belief in the Catholic Church which was founded by Christ.
And rather than find myself sinning (whether in anger or pride) it just often seems better to me not to participate.
John 5:36-39 36But the testimony that I have is greater than that of John. For the works that the Father has given me to accomplish, the very works that I am doing, bear witness about me that the Father has sent me. 37And the Father who sent me has himself borne witness about me. His voice you have never heard, his form you have never seen, 38and you do not have his word abiding in you, for you do not believe the one whom he has sent. 39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me, 40yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.
John 5:45-47 45Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father. There is one who accuses you: Moses, on whom you have set your hope. 46For if you believed Moses, you would believe me; for he wrote of me. 47But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?"
Romans 3:21-26 21But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— 22the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: 23for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. 26It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Perhaps it's just part of your faith but I have not heard any other church use this terminology so freely and without thought. Nobody says anti-Protestant...nor anti-mehodist...or any other denomination. It seems to apply only in the catholic language.
What some people can't wrap their brains around is that one can be a true believer, a real born again redeemed child of God and never darken the door of a church building, or affiliate with a denomination. Their spiritual identity has been so conditioned into them to consider their church to be their means of salvation, that they consider their church to be their spiritual identity as opposed to the simplicity and freedom of being in Christ.
“I don’t remember the Protestant author or the Protestant publication”
You can’t remember because it never happened. It is just a figment of your anti-protestant bias. Moody’s reputation is all the evidence one needs to refute your lie. I’m sure you won’t lose any sleep over your slander; one needs integrity for that.
Drama.....
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