Posted on 07/30/2011 10:13:06 AM PDT by NYer
Read the article in its entirety.
Sorry for being an uneducated dolt; back in the 50s/60s/70s never heard of ordination for women. I figured it’s some kind of new age feminist woman power sort of thing
How many of the Apostles were women?
My (Protestant) minister is female, and shes fabulous.
Has that "fabulous" woman explained what defense strategy she plans to mount during her particular judgment?
"Let women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted them to speak, but to be subject, as also the law saith. But if they would learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is a shame for a woman to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:34-35
Here's a proposed motto: Equal Hell for Equal Hubris.
I see no point in their current dishonest path.
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awesome post. my compliments, to you and your minister.
(i like how you say your opinion, without attacking.
i also respect my Christian brothers and sisters,
as long as they treat my church with the same respect.)
...and precisely because of your good points about honesty,
i question their true motives.
many many people split off from Lutheran churches, and form their own synod, etc.
and with the current debate in many churches,
about gay clergy, we see many congregations splitting.
so, why don’t these people, simply split, and from their own “Reformed Catholic Church” or something?
(or join an Anglican type church, which is similar, but permits women priests.)
instead, these, and other non-profits who object to church teachings, insist on calling themselves Catholic.
i think the people behind it, wish to destroy the Church,
just as many liberals in the USA with to destroy ALL Christian churches.
quite possibly yes, if care is not taken at the time of entrance to the seminaries. After all we read a lot about male AND female teachers sleeping with their students.
Not central to scripture? How God laid out the authority of the local church is not central? Wow, I don’t know what Bible you read. It isn’t the one God wanted you to read. “Hey God, I know your Holy word laid out that only men should be priests but well, we didn’t care and did our own thing.”
The Catholic Church considers laypeople and priests, women and men, adults and children, born and unborn, to be fundamentally equal in their human dignity. Ordaining some adult men as deacons, priests or bishops does not mark them as fundamentally superior, as you, perhaps, assume.
That mistaken assumption comes from seeing the priesthood as a status thing. And it's almost an inevitable mistake in a society where so many are concerned about status --- who can claim immunity from this tendency? --- and where so few are interested in being poor, chaste, and obedient.
Many would roll their eyes at this, which, of course, illustrates what I mean.
Yet the really important and really interesting people in Catholicism are not the priests, nor the popes, but the saints.
Women ministers as in preachers or teachers -- it is against what St. Paul said, there's no getting around that
HOWEVER, if you put that big statement aside (which is pretty much impossible, but just for hypothetical statement), women ministers/preachers/teachers are just as capable if not more capable than many men. In fact I'd also wager that a higher % of women get to heaven
So, ministers, administrators, I got no problem about (w.r.t. preachers, I think they're good, but Paul is clear that it's no, so I say no), but priests are something different.
the priest are those who are the instruments of the eucharist, where the REAL, TRUE body of Christ is present. This is taken as continuation of what Christ celebrated.
hence there just cannot be a priestess.
I am fully in support of nuns getting more administrative control - many convents etc. are run very well. Even maybe ministerial aspects. But as priestesses, no
What I think is that His choice of twelve men was culturally determined and not spiritually directive to us. He never chose a woman as a disciple, but he also never used the Internet to spread the Word.
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excellent point. certainly he would know, that many men back then, wouldn’t accept the authority of a woman.
makes sense...
except... He is Jesus.
he chose tax collectors, and touched lepers!
he talked to the woman at the well, and let her give him water. he intervened with the woman about to be stoned.
CLEARLY indicating, Jesus wasn’t afraid to go against the culture.
clearly indicating, that he was NOT bound, by culture.
and, even the early church followed the clear example of Jesus.
there were early church leaders that were women.
but not Priests.
so again, it is clear that it wasn’t for cultural reasons,
or women wouldn’t have been allowed to take leadership roles either.
it was only the Priesthood that was excluded.
one simply must conclude, that our Lord and Savior was FULLY aware of all of this?
and he chose only men for Apostles and the Priesthood, with laying on hands and the coming of the Holy Spirit.
Now my objection to him was that every Christian group that has first allowed pastoresses etc. eventually moves to having lesbian married pastoresses with gay partners.
How long has your denomination had pastoresses? And what is it's position on homosexual activity and homosexual ministers and marriage?
Yet the really important and really interesting people in Catholicism are not the priests, nor the popes, but the saints.
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beautiful beautiful post !!! (the entire thing!)
Quite correct. There is the ECUSA they can head off towards
"In any case, it's not my place to make that choice for the Roman Catholic Church, nor is it the place of a few rogue "bishops" with more loyalty to politics than to the Pope. The bishops are wrong to do this without authority." Good point, there. Very good point. "This one is not far from the Kingdom." :o)
Thank you for your gracious words :o)
I'm not sure how the Catholics do it, but I have seen an Orthodox Bishop being vested in front of the congregation. Several Deacons put various articles and bindings over his whole body while he stands mute - I think he has silent prayers to recite.
The effect is that of a surrender of the will and, if you will, laying down his life. My reaction was not "Look what an honor he has to be served like that."
No, it was "That poor man. May God have mercy on him."
Head any damned place they want.
I about got a bellyful of change.
I like tradition ,and rules that stay the same for the whole game.
These nuns who want to change the rules should take their Dyke butts on down the road.
Can women be ordained to the priesthood?
- - - - -
No. And I do not get why these radical feminists are so insistent. If they want to be priestesses, leave the Holy Mother Church and become Episcopalian.
This is not about Christ, this is about them and its disgusting. I would like to see more excommunications regarding this.
I have read and re-read all of your posts, and I will give them a great deal of thought, prayer, and study (that’s my primary topic for tomorrow, although one day will not be enough time). I do not consider it productive to go into too much detail on this topic or any religious topic on any public board. While general comments like those so far are harmless, there are lurkers on both conservative political and conservative religious boards who are always happy to use what they find in discussions like this to hurt God’s church as a whole. I have no desire to give the other side ammunition. We are facing FAR greater threats today than ever in America’s history, and possibly the worst in the Church’s history.
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