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Apparitions Exposed!
Proclaiming the Gospel ^ | former Director for a "Mary, Queen of Peace Center."

Posted on 04/12/2011 7:55:27 AM PDT by bkaycee

Can a born again Christian be a member of a cult and be involved in idol worship? I once thought this was an impossibility until it happened to me. Now I understand why Jesus warned us that, in the end times, there would be an appearance of great signs and miracles that would deceive even the elect, if possible. I confess I have been seduced by signs and miracles associated with apparitions of Mary, and I offer my testimony so others may be warned and delivered.

Until recently I was serving as Director of Public Relations for the Queen of Peace Center in Dallas, Texas. This non-profit organization disseminates information and messages from Marian apparitions in Medjugorje and around the world. I co-authored a full page ad that was published in the June 25, 1993, Dallas Morning News at a cost of $10,000. This add announced "Mary's" prescription for peace and listed locations of her recent appearances. It also listed phone numbers to call for up-to-day recorded messages of Mary's latest apparitions, such as the one in Dallas (214) 233-MARY. I once thought it was special to be the only non-Catholic on the Queen of Peace board . . . that is, until I met Mike Gendron and his wife, Jane.

A Divine Appointment

Neighbors and close friends of mine knew I was seriously contemplating becoming Roman Catholic. They told me that Mike had been a Roman Catholic for 37 years and was now a pastor at a non-denominational church in the Dallas area. They said he understood many of the issues involved in being Roman Catholic and could help me with my decision. I looked forward to meeting both Mike and his wife, not for my sake, but for theirs. I felt certain the information I had collected about "Our Lady's apparitions" in Medjugorje would surely lead them back home to the "true" (Roman Catholic) church. Providentially it appeared, I attended a Queen of Peace board meeting the night before we met and asked the board to pray for this lost pastor and his wife, who had fallen away. When I arrived at their door the next morning, I first introduced myself, before returning to my car for the large stack of books and newspapers I had brought to persuade them. The materials would help explain what was happening in Medjugorje and how the Virgin Mary would help change their lives.

Confronted by Contradictions

After we met, they showed me a film titled Catholicism: Crisis of Faith. This film lovingly and objectively contrasted how the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church contradicts the teachings of the Sacred Scriptures. Mike would stop the film after each segment for my questions and comments. Initially, I was argumentative and felt uneasy and rather adamant about what I was witnessing. Mike realized he had forgotten to pray before starting the film and asked if we could ask God to make His truth clear, and that all deception would be exposed. After the prayer my whole countenance changed.

Each question I asked, Mike validated his answers using Vatican II documents and an official Roman Catholic catechism. It was amazing to me how Roman Catholic teaching contradicts the very Word of God. Question after question, he would bring the Bible over to me and knell to show me verses in context. His servant's demeanor and patient, understanding heart helped in unraveling falsehood after falsehood. There wasn't a question I could have asked him that would have provoked anger. As a reflection of our Lord, this man allowed Jesus to pull the scales away from my eyes.

There were three things in the film and our discussion that were most alarming to me. First, a church in South America has Mary placed on a crucifix rather than Christ. It reminded me of my visit to Our Lady of Guadeloupe Cathedral in downtown Dallas where Mary is positioned as the focal point at the alter and the crucifix is placed in another part of the church. These two scenes made me realize idolatry is practiced within the church.

Second, the Roman Catholic Catechism by Rev. William Cogan, now in its 44th year of print, has altered the 10 commandments of God. The 2nd commandment given to Moses reads, "You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or in the earth beneath or in the water under the earth" (Exodus 20:4). The Roman Catholics have deleted this commandment but still came up with ten by splitting the 10th one into two separate commands. "You shall not covet your neighbor's good; and you shall not covet your neighbor's wife" (Exodus 20:17). I was reminded of the scriptural warnings for those who add to or subtract from the Bible.

Third, Mike told me the only place in the Bible in which the queen of heaven was referred to was in the Book of Jeremiah. He encouraged me to study the passage and it would expose another false doctrine concerning Mary. Anyone who is familiar with the prayers and meditations of the rosary can tell you that in one of the mysteries Christ supposedly crowned Mary the queen of heaven after she was assumed into heaven. Neither of these events have scriptural validity, but I had decided to blindly accept these doctrines because all of the other meditations on the life of Christ were verified by Scripture.

The Queen of Heaven

After returning home, I looked in the Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible for the passage in Jeremiah 44. Here, the Lord was angered by the wickedness of the people choosing to serve other gods. The people refused to listen to the Lord. Instead, they would "burn sacrifices to the Queen of Heaven and pour out libations to her." The woman "made for her sacrificial cakes in her image and poured out libations to her?" (Jeremiah 44:17, 19).

In Hebrew the word for queen has reference to "the heavenly handiwork" or "the stars of heaven." The reference might be to Ishtar, the goddess of love and fertility, who is identified with the Venus Star and is actually entitled "Mistress of Heaven." (The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, p. 975)

My head was spinning and filled with questions after reading this. Doesn't Mary usually appear with stars for her crown? Who then is the woman in Revelation 12:3-6? And most importantly, why would the Roman Catholic Church give the mother of Jesus the title of a pagan goddess? Had I been promoting the ministry of a pagan goddess whose messages were inconsistent with the Bible? Indeed her messages do contradict the Bible. In fact, she speaks of another gospel, another plan of salvation that nullifies and opposes the all sufficient sacrifice of Jesus. The apparition of Fatima said, "You have seen Hell where the souls of poor sinners go, so save them, God wishes to establish in the world, devotion to my Immaculate Heart." The apostle Paul condemned anyone, even an angel from heaven, who would dare preach a different way to be saved other than through the life, death, and resurrection of Christ (Galatians 1:6-10).

As for the woman described in Revelation, she is not Mary, the mother of Jesus, but God's chosen people, the Jews. When the passage in chapter 12 is read in context with the rest of the book, and Genesis 37:9-10, this clearly refers to the nation Israel. God fulfills His promise to the Jews, by protecting them in the desert during 3 1/2 years of tribulation.

I later realized my prayers to Mary and the saints, the reciting of rosaries and chaplets of divine mercy, and the wearing of Marian medals and scapulars had taken my focus off of Jesus. I had allowed doctrines of the Roman Catholic church to do the very thing Saint Paul warned against, "But I am afraid, lest as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, your minds should be led astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ." (2 Cor. 11:3).

An Angel of Light

Recently, a person whom I love dearly, and who has a "Marian devotion" asked me, "Why are you bothering the people who are already good people instead of worrying about those who are lost?" The answer came to me the other evening as the Lord continues to guide me through His sacred Word. Saint Paul wrote that "Satan masquerades as an angel of light" (2 Corinthians 11:14). We know the mother of Jesus would never oppose her Son, and since the apparitions do just that, they could very well be Satan masquerading as Mary. Saint Paul also wrote, "Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them . . . everything exposed by the light becomes visible" (Ephesians 5:11-14). Therefore, I feel called to expose these attempts by the evil one to divert people's devotion away from Jesus. The most authoritative way to do this is with the light of God's Holy Word. My new test for truthfulness is -- if it does not agree with the Scriptures then it must be rejected.

Freedom in the Truth

Now that I have torn down the altar in my bedroom, where I knelt and prayed to St. Anthony of Padua each night, and now that I have placed my rosaries, scapular and medals away, I have found a new freedom. The truth really does set people free! I have found special peace in knowing Jesus alone is my Savior, and not co-redemptrix with His mother. The Holy Spirit continues to lead me into all truth and is now the only teacher I need (1 John 2:27).

To all my precious friends who I have encouraged to seek Mary and to obey the misleading messages of her apparitions, I pray these Scriptures would minister to you -- "And it came about while He said these things, one of the women in the crowd raised her voice and said to Him, 'Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts at which you nursed.' But He said, 'On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the Word of God and observe it." (Luke 11:27-28)

This article was submitted by a former Director for a "Mary, Queen of Peace Center."


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Evangelical Christian; Theology
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To: presently no screen name
To your backtracking post I could went hard and heavy but some just aren't worth my precious God-given time!

I doubt it.

Pearls aren't too be used for some.

Boy, you got that right!

261 posted on 04/12/2011 7:54:35 PM PDT by WPaCon (Obama: pansy progressive, mad Mohammedan, or totalitarian tyrant? Or all three?)
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To: metmom

I dunno.

Also, I don’t care.


262 posted on 04/12/2011 7:55:39 PM PDT by WPaCon (Obama: pansy progressive, mad Mohammedan, or totalitarian tyrant? Or all three?)
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To: presently no screen name
It's not scriptural - is that a problem for you or not? God's Word tells you all you need to know.

What's not scriptural? Apparitions?

Complete codswallop!

Would you like me to list the apparitions in the New Testament?

Oh........but, but.........apparitions stopped when the New Testament was completed.

Really?

Sez who?

Furthermore, God always was - He doesn't have a mother. The man, Jesus, did because that is how He created man to be born.

Heresy.

Jesus is both true God and true man. And Mary is His Mother. Ergo, her motherhood is not compartmentalized nor confined to his humanity only.

Condemned by various councils of the Church and numerous Church Fathers.

Why do you need anyone to tell you to repent that you are so willing to accept the Mary fallacy?

This is not about me. The world is going to hell and we most definitely need to be called back to God with a "repent or else......" message.

At Cana, Mary said to the servants, "do whatever He tells you". She still says that to us today.

Are you happy to hear a pastor or a preacher call people to repentance?

Then why not the Mother of Jesus?

263 posted on 04/12/2011 8:02:07 PM PDT by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: Running On Empty; MarineBrat

I can only think of two times in my life where comments that could possibly be considered shots at other Christian denominations were made.

One was a quick comment in a homily about being saved by faith where the priest said something to the effect of “although you may sometimes hear about being saved by ‘faith alone’ from other Christians, that is not entirely true.”

The other was a priest saying about how he was surprised when a convert told him that in his past church, it was all about “hate.”

Those two examples are really stretching it. It says something when those are the worst things I can come up with.


264 posted on 04/12/2011 8:02:11 PM PDT by WPaCon (Obama: pansy progressive, mad Mohammedan, or totalitarian tyrant? Or all three?)
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To: metmom; WPaCon
You're certainly not the first one to read more into a post than is there.

And something I hadn't thought of. A catholic brings up the sexual connotation thinking they are my words while they are the words of the catholic pope. So he outs the pope. 'Mary, I'm yours' are vile and disgusting words with a sexual connotation spoken by their beloved pope. Maybe they are digging him up to reprimand him and not to honor him./s
265 posted on 04/12/2011 8:04:20 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: metmom

“I never heard of anyone but Catholics keeping Lent.”

The Orthodox? A fair amount of Protestants?


266 posted on 04/12/2011 8:04:32 PM PDT by WPaCon (Obama: pansy progressive, mad Mohammedan, or totalitarian tyrant? Or all three?)
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To: metmom

Again we are not a Sola Scriptura church. We also believe in Apostolic Tradition so beliefs arising from that are just as binding on the faithful as beliefs arising from Scripture. That has always been the case both for the Orthodox and the Catholic.

For an honest person the consequence of not believing it would be a crisis of faith. Fo a dishonest person it would be a chance to be a Cafeteria Catholic.

If you continue in this disbelief knowing such beliefs are binding on the faithful and with fulll knowledge and consent of will to that disbelief you certainly should not receive Communion. An honest person would become Protestant. A dishonest person would decide the Church was wrong and that they were not obligated to believe what their concscience did not agree with so it would be o.k. to continue being “Catholic.”

The ultimate consequence for claiming to be Catholic yet knowingly rejecting the Truth is to be in a state of Mortal sin. If one dies in a state of Mortal sin the consequence is hell.

That pertains to Catholics. Protestants do not have to believe Marian dogma.


267 posted on 04/12/2011 8:05:00 PM PDT by lastchance (Hug your babies.)
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To: presently no screen name
'Mary, I'm yours' are vile and disgusting words with a sexual connotation spoken by their beloved pope.

Those words do not have a sexual connotation when the pope uses them.

When you use those words, they do.

Context is key and so is considering the source.

For example, when Obama says he is going to change America, that may carry connotations of a sharp turn left and for the worse of the country.

If Ronald Reagan says he is going to change America, those connotations do not exist.

268 posted on 04/12/2011 8:11:48 PM PDT by WPaCon (Obama: pansy progressive, mad Mohammedan, or totalitarian tyrant? Or all three?)
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To: Running On Empty

When I was young, I wondered about what the controversy was about. All I heard was on the level of brief "street" comments made infrequently by an adult or two, which I didn't at all understand the history & motivations behind.

In all my later years, attending various churches, visiting many, never once did I hear any Anti-Roman Catholic mention, much less sermons, or portions thereof on the subject. The subject didn't even come up, pro, or con. Perhaps such doings are confined more to the types of denominations I rarely if ever visited.

I do remember, while about 30 years of age or so, asking my own grandmother a bit about it (my paternal grandfather was a Southern Baptist minister) and she carefully replied, something to the effect of "we believe in the blood of Christ..." adding, "not that and something else" [for the remission of sins, etc.]

I was not raised in their church, which I feel need of mentioning here, due to my other earlier mentions of my grandparents have always elicited later responses assuming I was raised "Southern Baptist".

I'm not saying such criticisms as you speak of do not occur, but I have missed them. Perhaps I didn't go to places where such could have been a staple?

Some of it may be in part geographical? Most of my life (other than brief or exceptional periods) I have lived either in Texas where I was raised, or in the West where I was both born, and have resided all my adult life.

East of the Mississippi is more densely populated. I wonder if it's different there.

On the other hand, I have seen one particular Catholic televangelist type rail on and one concerning "heretics" and other outsiders while he also spent much timing carrying on about "being a good Catholic", and the importance and authority of the Catholic priesthood, etc.

It was such a habit with him, that when I once caught the show and heard him seeming to be preaching the Gospel, I was rather surprised, almost shocked, and left wondering if the fellow had not grown some over the years.

Otherwise, I've gotten an ear full from either perspective, here on FR. Oh, yes indeedy!

269 posted on 04/12/2011 8:25:07 PM PDT by BlueDragon (tonto he got smart said listenkimmosabe, kissmyass I boughtaboat, I'm headedout to sea)
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To: metmom
It's already in the Bible. All anyone has to do is read it.

Of course it is. But people are not reading it. That's the point. Look out the window. See that mayhem and chaos? It's the world going to hell.

That's what the Blessed Mother is saying; turn back to God.

Why do Catholics need apparitions to tell them what has been in the Bible for 2,000 years? Isn't the Bible good enough? Don't they believe it? Does it really take an apparition to convince them of what God and Jesus have plainly said many times in Scripture?

And the Jews of old had the law but did that stop them wandering all over creation and getting into strife and rebeling? Of course not.

So what happened?

God sent prophets to warn the Jews and call them to back to repentance.

That's still happening.

God is still sending messengers, to call us back to repentance. One of them is the Mother of Jesus.

Furthermore, if you read the words of the Blessed Mother you'll see that they are not addressed only to Catholics. She is the Mother of all men (given to us under the cross....."son behold your mother...") and they are addressed to all mankind.

270 posted on 04/12/2011 8:26:46 PM PDT by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: metmom

1 Corinthians 1:20-24 (King James Version)

20Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

21For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

22For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

23But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

24But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.


271 posted on 04/12/2011 8:30:33 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to him.)
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To: WPaCon
Those words do not have a sexual connotation when the pope uses them. When you use those words, they do.

Bottom of the barrel response. I can't accuse you of mind reading because that sexual connotation never entered my mind but I will accuse you of slurring me with your sexual connotation and vile and disgusting remark.
272 posted on 04/12/2011 8:36:50 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: BlueDragon

Blue, I am sorry you have gotten an earful. I only got an earful once when I accidentally stumbled into an anti-Mormon thread and commented on the intemperate remarks. I won’t make that mistake again.

I try to avoid the back and forth that goes on. Arguing about the faith with strangers ain’t my thing. This topic of Medjugorje in the article is really a serious matter. I would have liked to hear some SOBER discussion of the topic, but that cannot happen here.


273 posted on 04/12/2011 8:45:42 PM PDT by campaignPete R-CT (Palin '12 begins in '11. In western New Hampshire pour moi.)
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To: WPaCon; presently no screen name

Facts are irrelevant then?


274 posted on 04/12/2011 8:50:36 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Iscool; Quix; RnMomof7; smvoice; metmom; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; ...
The testimony is wanting, but as regards Mary's exaltation above that which is written" (and i need to exalt Jesus more): (1Cor. 4:6)


"That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;" (Philippians 2:10)

"And the loftiness of man shall be bowed down, and the haughtiness of men shall be made low: and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day." (Isaiah 2:17)

"Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. {6} And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another." (1 Corinthians 4:5-6)

"And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon." (Revelation 5:4)

"And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; {10} And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. {11} And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands; {12} Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing." (Revelation 5:9-12)

We must never adore her; that is for God alone. But otherwise we cannot honor her to excess, because it is not possible to overestimate the privileges God gave her in making her His own Mother. “What the church teaches,” by Monsignor J.D. Conway/ Imprimatur of Ralph L. Hayes,, New York; Harper and Brothers; 1962 (He also states, “It seems manifest that Christians simply adapted the art of pagan Rome to their religious needs:” p. 218)

Alex responded this in 2,078 and tt is difficult to distinguish between latria, dulia and hyperdulia as such is of the heart. As as one commentator stated,

Although (technically) Mary is not to be worshipped in the same sense that God is worshipped, she is to be granted devotion and worship in a lesser sense. And if the fine distinctions made by Catholic theologians "are usually not reflected in the practice of the faithful," idolatry would seem to be a distinct possibility in the lives of the faithful. Thus, "By the sixteenth century, as evidenced by the spiritual struggles of the Reformers, the image of Mary had largely eclipsed the centrality of Jesus Christ in the life of believers." (Robert C. Broderick, ed., The Catholic Encyclopedia, revised and updated; NY: Thomas Nelson Publishers, 1987pp.32,33),

Yet there is a Biblical basis for distinguishing forms. While bowing down normally denotes worship of God, and hence bowing down to idols is forbidden, there are a few times when it occurs toward man in a sanctioned way which denotes respect, or obeisance and submission due to one's position, such as Abraham (Gn. 23:12) and toward Jacob and Joseph, (Gn. 27:29; 37:10; 42:6; 43:28) and to worship (proskuneō, trans. worship elsewhere in KJV) before faithful Christians because Jesus love for them. (Rev 3:9)

However, what is lacking in such is the manner of adulation on steroids given to holy Mary above that which is written, against which we are warned. (1Cor. 4:6) Thus rather than Mary being remembered and honored as a holy women who was blessed above women because of whom she was privileged to mother, she is lauded as being intrinsically superior to every women that lived, with an adulation that befits Christ not man, and is made like Him is many ways beyond what Scripture reveals, with Divine functions and privileges being ascribed to her.

As Jesus is sinless, so is Mary; as He shed His sinless blood for our sins so Mary did by Him, and as He redeemed the word so Mary is made co redemptorist (the logic behind which can lead back to Eve); she being “the cause of salvation for herself and for the whole human race. (Irenaeus of Lyons, Adversus haereses 3:22) As Jesus rose bodily to glory so did Mary, and as souls come to God by Him so they come by Mary to Jesus, and as Jesus can hear prayers unlimited and constantly makes intercession so does Mary, and one may obtain through her what they could not by coming directly through Christ, or sooner; and as Jesus is the dispenser of grace so Mary, and the so forth. This is not what is evident Biblical, and its extremes can only be extrapolated the same way Mormonic doctrine is, with its beginning starting with a little extra-Biblical leaven which leaven the whole lump, with extra-Biblical tradition being the substance for such, justified through the Catholic science of development of doctrine.

The Catholic Encyclopedia explains below (emphasis mine) the development Marian devotion, and that one aspect seen among a couple church fathers was the idea the martyrs, that since by their death they

could obtain graces and blessings for others, naturally and immediately led to their direct invocation.

A further reinforcement, of the same idea, was derived from the cult of the angels, which, while pre-Christian in its origin, was heartily embraced by the faithful of the sub-Apostolic age. It seems to have been only as a sequel of some such development that men turned to implore the intercession of the Blessed Virgin. This at least is the common opinion among scholars, though it would perhaps be dangerous to speak too positively. Evidence regarding the popular practice of the early centuries is almost entirely lacking, and while on the one hand the faith of Christians no doubt took shape from above downwards (i.e. the Apostles and teachers of the Church delivered a message which the laity accepted from them with all docility)”

Thus the substantiation for what came to beyond what is written is asserted to surely have (nebulous oral) tradition as its source, thus effectively Rome holds to an open canon, as does Mormonism, while its supreme authority is its self-proclaimed assuredly infallible magisterium, which is the foundational issue, as by it all things are established. Thus regarding those who disagree that Mary was preserved sinless, the Pope presumes to pronounce,

Hence, if anyone shall dare which God forbid to think otherwise than has been defined by us, let him know and understand that he is condemned by his own judgment, that he has suffered shipwreck in the faith, that he has separated from the unity of the Church and that furthermore by his own action he incurs the penalties established by Law if he should dare to express in words or writing or by any other outward means the error he thinks in his heart.” (Ineffabilis Deus, Pope Pius IX on December 8, 1854)

Of course, not all the extremes of Marian devotion are officially sanctioned by the church, wisely so, but too many are (what is written in encyclicals is generally understood to be infallible, and some hold all are):

The foundation of all Our confidence, as you know well, Venerable Brethren, is found in the Blessed Virgin Mary. For, God has committed to Mary the treasury of all good things, in order that everyone may know that through her are obtained every hope, every grace, and all salvation. For this is His will, that we obtain everything through Mary.” Pope Pius IX, in Ubi Primum (On the Immaculate Conception), Encyclical promulgated on February 2, 1849, #5.
The power thus put into her (Mary’s) hands is all but unlimited. How unerringly right, then, are Christian souls when they turn to Mary for help...How rightly, too, has every nation and every liturgy without exception acclaimed her great renown, which has grown greater with the voice of each succeeding century. Among her many other titles we find her hailed as ‘our Lady, our Mediatrix,’ (St. Bernard, Serm.II in Adv. 4) ‘the Reparatrix of the whole world,’ (St. Tharasius, Orat. in Praesentatione) ‘the Dispenser of all heavenly gifts.’ (On Off. Graec., 8 Dec.).” Pope Leo XIII, in Adiutricem (On the Rosary), Encyclical promulgated on September 5, 1895, #8.
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13adiut.htm

O Virgin most holy, none abounds in the knowledge of God except through thee; none, O Mother of God, attains salvation except through thee; none receives a gift from the throne of mercy except through thee.’” Pope Leo XIII, in Adiutricem (On the Rosary), Encyclical promulgated on September 5, 1895, #9.
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13adiut.htm

With equal truth may it be also affirmed that, by the will of God, Mary is the intermediary through whom is distributed unto us this immense treasure of mercies gathered by God, for mercy and truth were created by Jesus Christ. Thus as no man goeth to the Father but by the Son, so no man goeth to Christ but by His Mother....Mary is this glorious intermediary...” Pope Leo XIII, in Octobri Mense (On the Rosary), Encyclical promulgated on September 22, 1891, # 4.
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13ro1.htm

Thus is confirmed that law of merciful meditation of which We have spoken, and which St. Bernardine of Siena thus expresses: ‘Every grace granted to man has three degrees in order; for by God it is communicated to Christ, from Christ it passes to the Virgin, and from the Virgin it descends to us.’”Pope Leo XIII, in Iucunda Semper Expectatione (On the Rosary), Encyclical promulgated on September 8, 1894, #5.
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13ro5.htm

All gifts which the Author of all good (God) has deigned to communicate to the unhappy posterity of Adam, are, according to the loving resolve of His Divine Providence, dispensed by the hands of the Most Holy Virgin.” Pope Benedict XV (AAS 9, 1917, 266) (quoted in “About Our Lady, our Blessed Mother”, by Our Lady’s Warriors).
http://www.ourladyswarriors.org/abtmary.htm

.When therefore we read in the writings of Saint Bernard, Saint Bernardine, Saint Bonaventure, and others that all in heaven and on earth, even God himself, is subject to the Blessed Virgin, they mean that the authority which God was pleased to give her is so great that she seems to have the same power as God. Her prayers and requests are so powerful with him that he accepts them as commands in the sense that he never resists his dear mother’s prayer because it is always humble and conformed to his will.... St. Louis de Montfort, in Treatise on True Devotion to the Blessed Virgin, #27, 246. http://www.ewtn.com/library/Montfort/TRUEDEVO.HTM

In conclusion: we may say that, in virtue of the divine salvific counsels ordaining a most perfect redemption, our Lady as Coredemptrix is included with Christ, the One Mediator.Rev. Fr. Peter Damian M. Fehlner, F.F.I., professor of Catholic Theology, in Immaculata Mediatrix — Toward a Dogmatic Definition of the Coredemption.
http://www.voxpopuli.org/book_2_10.php

Pope Pius XII explains in an address on the Queenship of Mary, ‘when the glorious Virgin Mary entered triumphantly into heaven and was elevated above the choirs of angels to the throne of the Most Holy Trinity.’ And then Christ ‘placed a triple crown of glory on her head, presented her to the heavenly court, seated her at his right hand and pronounced her Queen of the Universe.’...Opus Sanctorum Angelorum, Formation Letter, “Mary - ‘Regina Angelorum’”, April, 2000.
http://www.opusangelorum.org/Formation/Maryregina.html

Mary's role as its intercessor was spelled out in the 12th century by theologians, such as Eadmer, (c. 1124) and St. Peter Damian, and was popularized in collections of her miracles. Mary placates the judge. According to Eadmer (A.D. 1060–1124), an English monk and student of Anselm, “sometimes salvation is quicker if we remember Mary's name then if we invoked the name of the Lord Jesus...[who] does not at once, answer anyone who invokes him, but only does so after just judgment. But if the name of his mother Mary is invoked, her merits intercede so that he is answered even if the merits of him who invoked her do not deserve it.”

In the word says Anselm, through her “the elements are renewed, the netherworld is healed, the demons are trodden underfoot, men are saved and angels are restored.” in the margins out, Smithfield decretals, began again, for over a hundred folios, Mary asserts her power over devils-and sometimes also over Jews. Andrew Taylor, “Three medieval manuscripts and their readers,” University of Pennsylvania press; page 173

The late Walter Martin noted,

I have in my library hundreds of pamphlets, manuscripts and books all published with the official imprimatur of the Roman Catholic Church. In every one of them, language which is applied to God alone in Scripture is applied to the Virgin Mary. She is worshipped: she is given almost every title of Christ. Thus, they are subtly but systematically raising her to a place of equality with our Lord.... Worship, prayers, shrines, and even altars in churches have been consecrated to her around the earth. The healing grottoes are seldom dedicated to Jesus of Nazareth, but to "Our Lady of Lourdes," "Our Lady St. Anne de Beaupre," "Our Lady of Fatima," etc. The statues which are seen in Roman Catholic homes are invariably of Mary. The largest niches in Roman Catholic churches are occupied by images of Mary. The preponderance of prayers are to Mary, and the "Hail, Mary" is repeated in the Rosary continually. (Walter Martin, The Roman Catholic Church in History (Livingston, NJ: Christian Research Institute, Inc., 1960), p.54) 2,241

Alphabetical list of appellations magnifying Mary (from Roman Catholic “Tom's Domain:” http://tomsdomain.com/rosary/titles.htm)

101. Mary the Blessed Virgin

102. Mary, Blessed Virgin

103. Mary, Help of Christians

104. Mary, Mother of God

105. Mary, Queen of Africa

106. Mary, Queen of Angels

107. Mary, Queen of Peace

108. Mary, Star of the Sea

109. Mater Dei

110. Mediatrix

111. Mediatrix and Conciliatrix

112. Mediatrix of All Graces

113. Mediatrix of Salvation

114. Mediatrix of the Mediator

115. Minister of Life

116. More Beautiful Than Beauty

117. More Glorious Than Paradise

118. More Gracious Than Grace

119. More Holy Than the Cherubim, the Seraphim, and the Entire Angelic Hosts

120. Most Venerable

121. Mother Most Admirable

122. Mother Most Amiable

123. Mother Most Chaste

124. Mother Most Pure

125. Mother Inviolate

126. Mother of Christians

127. Mother of Christ's Members

128. Mother of God

129. Mother of Good Counsel

130. Mother of Jesus Christ

131. Mother of Men

132. Mother of Our Creator

133. Mother of Our Head

134. Mother of Our Savior

135. Mother of the Mystical Body

136. Mother of Wisdom

137. Mother Undefiled

138. My Body's Healing

139. My Soul's Saving

140. Nativity of the Blessed Virgin

141. Nature's Re-Creation

142. Nature's Restoration

143. Neck of the Mystical Body

144. Never Fading Wood

145. New Eve

146. Notre Dame Cathedral of Paris

147. Notre Dame of Chartres

148. Notre Dame of Easton

149. Nourisher of God and Man

150. Olive Tree of the Father's Compassion

151. Only Bridge of God to Men

152. Our Immaculate Queen

153. Our Lady, Gate of Heaven

154. Our Lady, Help of Christians

155. Our Lady, Mother of the Church

156. Our Lady, Queen of All Saints

157. Our Lady, Queen of the Apostles

158. Our Lady in America

159. Our Lady Mediatrix of All Grace

160. Our Lady of Africa

161. Our Lady of Altotting

162. Our Lady of Arabia

163. Our Lady of Bandel

164. Our Lady of Bandra

165. Our Lady of Banneux

166. Our Lady of Baeuraing

167. Our Lady of Begoña

168. Our Lady of Bethlehem

169. Our Lady of Calvary

170. Our Lady of Charity

171. Our Lady of Consolation

172. Our Lady of Copacabana

173. Our Lady of Coromoto

174. Our Lady of Czestochowa

175. Our Lady of Europe

176. Our Lady of Fatima

177. Our Lady of Good Counsel

178. Our Lady of Good Help

179. Our Lady of Grace

180. Our Lady of Guadalupe

181. Our Lady of Guadalupe of Estramadura

182. Our Lady of High Grace

183. Our Lady of Hungary

184. Our Lady of Japan

185. Our Lady of Kevelaer

186. Our Lady of Knock

187. Our Lady of La Leche

188. Our Lady of La Vang

189. Our Lady of Las Vegas

190. Our Lady of LaSallette

191. Our Lady of Lebanon

192. Our Lady of Limerick

193. Our Lady of Loreto

194. Our Lady of Lourdes

195. Our Lady of Lujan

196. Our Lady of Madhu

197. Our Lady of Mariazell

198. Our Lady of Mercy

199. Our Lady of Montserrat

200. Our Lady of Mount Carmel

201. Our Lady of Mount Carmel at Aylesford

202. Our Lady of Nazareth

203. Our Lady of Peace

204. Our Lady of Perpetual Help

205. Our Lady of Pompeii

206. Our Lady of Pontmain

207. Our Lady of Prompt Succor

208. Our Lady of Providence

209. Our Lady of Ransom

210. Our Lady of Refuge

211. Our Lady of Safe Travel

212. Our Lady of Salambao

213. Our Lady of Shongweni

214. Our Lady of Sorrows

215. Our Lady of Tears

216. Our Lady of Victory

217. Our Lady of Walsingham

218. Our Lady of Washington

219. Our Lady of the Americas

220. Our Lady of the Assumption

221. Our Lady of the Cape

222. Our Lady of the Conquest

223. Our Lady of the Golden Heart

224. Our Lady of the Gulf

225. Our Lady of the Hermits

226. Our Lady of the Highways

227. Our Lady of the Holy Rosary

228. Our Lady of the Holy Souls

229. Our Lady of the Immaculate Conception

230. Our Lady of the Incarnation

231. Our Lady of the Kodiak and the Islands

232. Our Lady of the Milk and Happy Delivery

233. Our Lady of the Miraculous Medal

234. Our Lady of the Pillar of Saragossa

235. Our Lady of the Pines

236. Our Lady of the Prairie

237. Our Lady of the Presentation

238. Our Lady of the Rosary

239. Our Lady of the Snows

240. Our Lady of the Thorns

241. Our Lady of the Turumba

242. Our Lady of the Valley

243. Our Lady of the Wayside

244. Our Lady of the Woods

245. Our Lady Who Appeared

246. Our Own Sweet Mother

247. Paradise Fenced Against the Serpent

248. Paradise of Innocence and Immortality

249. Paradise of the Second Adam

250. Paradise Planted by God

251. Patroness and Protectoress

252. Perfume of Faith

253. Preserved From All Sin

254. Protectress From All Hurt

255. Queen of All Saints

256. Queen of Angels

257. Queen of Creation

258. Queen of Heaven

259. Queen of Heaven and Earth

260. Queen of Martyrs

261. Queen of Nigeria

262. Queen of Peace

263. Queen Unconquered

264. Refuge in Time of Danger

265. Reparatrix

266. Reparatrix of Her Parents

267. Reparatrix of the Lord World

268. Rich in Mercy

269. Rose Ever Blooming

270. Sanctuary of the Holy Spirit

271. Salve Regina

272. Scepter of Orthodoxy

273. Seat of Wisdom

274. Second Eve

275. Singular Vessel of Devotion

276. Sister and Mother

277. Source of Virginity

278. Spiritual Vessel

279. Spotless Dove of Beauty

280. Star of the Sea

281. Star That Bore the Sea

282. Suppliant for Sinners

283. Surpassing Eden's Gardens

284. Surpassing the Heavens

285. Surpassing the Seraphim

286. Sweet Flowering and Gracious Mercy

287. Tabernacle of God

288. Tabernacle of the Word

289. Temple Divine

290. Temple Indestructible

291. Temple of the Lord's Body

292. Theotokos

293. Throne of the King

294. Tower Unassailable

295. Treasure House of Life

296. Treasure of Immortality

297. Treasure of the World Undefiled

298. Undefiled Treasure of Virginity

299. Undug Well of Remission's Waters

300. Unlearned in the Ways of Eve

301. Unplowed Field of Heaven's Bread

302. Unwatered Vineyard of Immortality's Wine

303. Vessel of Honor

304. Victor Over the Serpent

305. Virgin by the Sea

306. Virgin Inviolate

307. Virgin Most Faithful

308. Virgin Most Merciful

309. Virgin Most Powerful

310. Virgin Most Prudent

311. Virgin Most Pure

312. Virgin Mother

313. Virgin of Charity

314. Virgin of Copacabana

315. Virgin of Sheshan

316. Virgin of Virgins

317. Wedded to God

318. Workshop of the Incarnation

From the "Litany of the Blessed Virgin"


1. Holy Mary

2. Holy Mother of God

3. Most Honored of Virgins

4. Chosen Daughter of the Father

5. Mother of Christ

6. Glory of the Holy Spirit

7. Virgin Daughter of Zion

8. Virgin Poor and Humble

9. Virgin Gentle and Obedient

10. Handmaid of the Lord

11. Mother of the Lord

12. Helper of the Redeemed

13. Full of Grace

14. Fountain of Beauty

15. Model of Virtue

16. Finest Fruit of the Redemption

17. Perfect Disciple of Christ

18. Untarnished Image of the Church

19. Woman Transformed

20. Woman Clothed With the Sun

21. Woman Crowned With Stars

22. Gentile Lady

23. Gracious Lady

24. Our Lady

25. Joy of Israel

26. Splendor of the Church

27. Pride of the Human Race

28. Advocate of Grace

29. Minister of Holiness

30. Champion of God's People

31. Queen of Love

32. Queen of Mercy

33. Queen of Peace

34. Queen of Angels

35. Queen of Patriarchs and Prophets

36. Queen of Apostles and Martyrs

37. Queen of Confessors and Virgins

38. Queen of All Saints

39. Queen Conceived Without Original Sin

40. Queen Assumed into Heaven

41. Queen of All Earth

42. Queen of Heaven

43. Queen of the Universe

From Other Miscellaneous Sources


Note: Some of these might be considered duplicates as they are slight variations of each other (E.g., Lady of the Rosary and Our Lady of the Rosary). Both are left in the list as one might be more appropriate in some circumstances.


1. Adam's Deliverance

2. Advocate of Eve

3. Advocate of Sinners

4. All Chaste

5. All Fair and Immaculate

6. All Good

7. Annunciation of the Blessed Virgin

8. Aqueduct of Grace

9. Archetype fo Purity and Innocence

10. Ark Gilded by the Holy Spirit

11. Assumption of the Blessed Virgin

12. Basillica of Saint Mary Major

13. Blessed Among Women

14. Blessed Virgin Mary

15. Bridal Chamber of the Lord

16. Bride of Christ

17. Bride of Heaven

18. Bride of the Canticle

19. Bride of the Father

20. Bride Unbrided

21. Chosen Before the Ages

22. Comfort of Christians

23. Comforter of the Afflicted

24. Conceived Without Original Sin

25. Consoler of the Afflicated

26. Co-Redemptrix

27. Court of the Eternal King

28. Created Temple of the Creator

29. Crown of Virginity

30. Daughter of Men

31. David's Daughter

32. Deliverer From All Wrath

33. Deliverer of Christian Nations

34. Destroyer of Heresies

35. Dispenser of Grace

36. Dwelling Place for God

37. Dwelling Place Meet for God

38. Dwelling Place of the Illimitable

39. Dwelling Place of the Spirit

40. Earth Unsown

41. Earth Untouched and Virginal

42. Eastern Gate

43. Ever Green and Fruitful

44. Ever Virgin

45. Eve's Tears Redeeming

46. Exalted Above the Angels

47. Feast of the Immaculate Conception

48. Fleece of Heavenly Rain

49. Flower of Carmel

50. Flower of Jesse's Root

51. Formed Without Sin

52. Forthbringer of God

53. Forthbringer of the Ancient of Days

54. Forthbringer of the Tree of Life

55. Fountain of Living Water

56. Fountain Sealed

57. Free From Every Stain

58. Garden Enclosed

59. God's Eden

60. God's Olive Tree

61. God's Vessel

62. Healing Balm of Integrity

63. Helper of All in Danger

64. Holy in Soul and Body

65. Holy Mountain of Our Lady

66. Hope of Christians

67. House Built by Wisdom

68. Immaculate

69. Immaculate Conception

70. Immaculate Heart

71. Immaculate Heart of Mary

72. Immaculate Mary

73. Immaculate Mother

74. Immaculate Virgin

75. Incorruptible Wood of the Ark

76. Inventrix of Grace

77. Inviolate

78. Joseph's Spouse

79. Kingly Throne

80. King's Mother

81. Lady Most Chaste

82. Lady Most Venerable

83. Lady of Good Help

84. Lady of Grace

85. Lady of Mercy

86. Lady of Peace

87. Lady of Perpetual Help

88. Lady of the Rosary

89. Lady of Sorrows

90. Lady of Victory

91. Lamp Unquenchable

92. Life-Giver to Posterity

93. Light Cloud of Heavenly Rain

94. Lily Among Thorns

95. Living Temple of the Diety

96. Loom of the Incarnation

97. Madonna of Saint Luke

98. Marketplace for Salutary Exchange

99. Mary of the Assumptions

100. Mary of the Hurons

From the "Litany of Loreto"


1. Mother of the Church

2. Mother of Divine grace

3. Mother Most Pure

4. Mother of Chaste Love

5. Mother and Virgin

6. Sinless Mother

7. Dearest of Mothers

8. Model of Motherhood

9. Mother of Good Counsel

10. Mother of Our Creator

11. Mother of Our Savior

12. Virgin Most Wise

13. Virgin Rightly Praised

14. Virgin Rightly Renowned

15. Virgin Most Powerful

16. Virgin Gentle in Mercy

17. Faithful Virgin

18. Mirror of Justice

19. Throne of Wisdom

20. Cause of Our Joy

21. Shrine of the Spirit

22. Glory of Israel

23. Vessel of Selfless Devotion

24. Mystical Rose

25. Tower of David

26. Tower of Ivory

27. House of Gold

28. Ark of the Covenant

29. Gate of Heaven

30. Morning Star

31. Health of the Sick

32. Refuge of Sinners

33. Comfort of the Troubled

35. Queen of the Rosary

36. Queen of Peace [repeated from above]


In "Glories of Mary" by Liguori, whose writings at the time of his canonization were declared to be absolutely free from error (such as by Pope Gregory XVL in the bull of canonization in 1839), he teaches,

“He who is under the protection of Mary will be saved; he who is not will be lost . . . O immaculate Virgin, we are under thy protection, and therefore we have recourse, to thee alone, and we beseech thee to prevent thy beloved Son, who is irritated by our sins, from abandoning us to the power of the devil. - . . Thou (Mary) art my only hope. . . . Lady in heaven, we have but one advocate, and that is thyself, and thou alone art truly loving and solicitous for our salvation ... My Queen and my Advocate with thy Son, whom I dare not approach “ (From Judge Fairly, p. 5).

The following quotes are from the book “Ten Series of Meditations on the Mystery of the Rosary,” by John Ferraro, whose book was given the Nihil Obstat and the Imprimatur, which is an official statement by the Roman Catholic Church that the book "is free of doctrinal or moral error."

(a) She [Mary] is co-Redemptrix of the human race.

(b) The church and the saints greet her thus: "You, O Mary, together with Jesus Christ, redeemed us."

(c) God has ordained that no grace will be granted to us except through Mary. It is a doctrine preached by all the saints that no grace will come to us from heaven without passing through Mary's hands. No one will be saved nor obtain mercy except through You, O' heavenly lady. Remember this well, no one will enter heaven without passing through Mary as one would pass through a door. O' Mary, our salvation is in your hands.

(d) During His passion, Mary suffered in her heart all the pains that Jesus suffered in His body. For this reason, God exalted her so greatly.

(e) Mary is our co-Redemptrix because she gave us Jesus pledge of our salvation. Furthermore, she is co-Redemptrix of the human race, because with Christ she ransomed mankind from the power of Satan.

(f) Jesus redeemed us with the blood of His body, Mary with the agonies of her heart.

(g) We were condemned through the fault of one woman; we are saved through the merits of another woman. Just as Eve was the root of death for everyone, so Mary was the source of life for everyone.

(h) Mary is our co-Redemptrix because she suffered in her heart whatever was lacking in the passion of Christ. Are we obligated to Jesus for His passions? -- so we are indebted to Mary for her participation in His passions. She gave birth to Jesus with joy; she gave birth to us, brothers of Jesus, in anguish and sorrow.

(i) Mary, Queen of the Apostles: She is queen of apostles because she formed them and directed them in their preaching. Mary is Queen of Apostles because by herself she routed all the heresies. Mary is Queen of Apostles because she is mother of grace and channel of mercy. She is Queen of Apostles because in her every hope is life and virtue. She is Queen of Apostles because she is conqueror of the Infernal Dragon. (Emphasis added.)

(j) If we spread devotion to Mary, we will gain heaven -- "Who explains me will have life everlasting."

(k) God shared His power with her [Mary]. "My mother, ask, for I must not turn away your face." Christ speaking to Mary: "Without your command, no one shall move hand or foot in the whole land."

(l) All grace is passed from God to Jesus, from Jesus to Mary, and from Mary to us. The grace of God, cure for our ills, comes to us through Mary like water through an aqueduct.

(m) Mary is the compliment of the Holy Spirit. Before God she asks not -- she commands!

(n) No true devotee of Mary will be damned because she is the terrible conqueror of the devil.

(o) Because she believed in Christ's mission of salvation, she became the co-Redemptrix of the whole human race.

(p) Mary is holier than the saints, loftier than the heavens, more glorious than the cherubim, more venerable than any other creature.

(q) No one can acquire an intimate union with Jesus and a perfect fidelity to the Holy Spirit without being greatly united with Mary.

(r) It is necessary for us to have a mediator besides Jesus as mediator, and we will never find one more qualified than Mary. (Emphasis added.)

(s) It was never written of anyone that he became a saint without having a special devotion to Mary.

(u) Mary is the ark of salvation built by God on the deluge of our faults so that whoever desires may enter and be saved.

(w) It is important to be devoted to Mary as it is to enter heaven, because no one can enter Paradise who is not devoted to Mary.

(x) In reward for humility, God gave to Mary the power of filling with blessed souls the thrones left empty by the rebellious angels.

(y) Mary is secretary of the King of Heaven. It is she who writes in the Book of Life the names of the predestined, and signs them with the emblem of God. She herself is the Book of Life from which God will read the names of the elect on the day of judgment.

It is indeed grievous extrapolate a Heaven demi-godess out of Scripture, while the Bible rightly honors her but not as an object of prayer, etc. To Christ the Holy Spirit directs us, as the one uniquely qualified to be our intercessor, being the only One who "was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need." (Heb 4:16). And as all power in Heaven and on earth is given to Him, He is not only all perfect but all powerful, and is not shown delegating others in Heaven to handle prayer requests, and earthly analogies fail. We thus have no need of praying other Heavenly intercessors. The Bible offers NONE, and to pray to another is an insult to Christ.

(Heb 7:25) "Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.


275 posted on 04/12/2011 9:01:31 PM PDT by daniel1212 ( "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out," Acts 3:19)
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To: campaignPete R-CT

I think there was some of that from those of either, er, camp. Attempts to, anyway.

276 posted on 04/12/2011 9:02:41 PM PDT by BlueDragon (tonto he got smart said listenkimmosabe, kissmyass I boughtaboat, I'm headedout to sea)
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To: WPaCon

“Christians” like that used to wear hoods and burn things.


277 posted on 04/12/2011 9:04:57 PM PDT by mgstarr ("Some of us drink because we're not poets." Arthur (1981))
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To: lastchance

So, not believing in the Catholic church’s teachings about Mary is a mortal sin, condemning the person to hell?

That makes the Catholic’s salvation dependent on what they do with teachings about Mary.

Then where does Jesus fit into salvation?


278 posted on 04/12/2011 9:10:16 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom

It is Jesus’ Christ’s Churc so to believe what it teaches is to believe in what God has revealed.


279 posted on 04/12/2011 9:11:36 PM PDT by lastchance (Hug your babies.)
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To: BlueDragon; Running On Empty
Re: Anti-Catholic preaching

I was born and raised in the Roman Catholic Church but my paternal grandparents were Southern Baptist. We visited them many, many times and I never remember them saying ANYTHING derogatory about Catholics or Catholicism. When we stayed summers with them. I remember attending Vacation Bible School and even there, I do not recall any recriminations. My grandparents were always respectful but now I can see how the Lord used their loving guidance. I recall watching Billy Graham on TV many times and I truly think the Lord used that as well to touch my heart. Seeds were being planted and tenderly watered all along.

It wasn't until I was almost sixteen and we moved across the street to them that I finally "heard" the gospel of salvation by grace through faith. My parents had divorced several years earlier and we had gone to live with my Dad and stepmother. Before we moved next to G&G, I remember praying on the way home from Mass, "God, if you're real, if there is any such thing as truth, I want to know it.". All those years in Catholicism did not answer my soul questions. So as I said, when we did move near them we started attending their church and a dear Sunday school teacher showed me John 10:27-30, "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one."

The Holy Spirit spoke to my soul and I heard the voice of my savior, my shepherd, I knew that this was the truth I had searched for. I did not ask the teacher it's meaning because I understood the meaning as soon as I read it. God revealed it to me. He said he gave me eternal life and I could not be lost again. From that moment on, my life was changed.

So, I think my point is that regardless of arguments for or against, those who seek the truth will be rewarded with it. If we seek him with all our hearts, we will find him - He promised.

280 posted on 04/12/2011 9:11:44 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to him.)
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