Posted on 03/05/2011 5:29:44 AM PST by WPaCon
Thank you, Revolting Cat! for the compliment. You are a quite reasonable person, the type of person we often lack in these threads. I agree with pretty much everything you said in this post.
To continue our conversation, I think a great deal of believers have had their doubts at some point, and it is quite normal, although some never do. I hope one day that you come back to the Faith, and that it will serve you well.
I have to say that many people who have gone through great problems still believed in God, although others have not. Even on this site, I think there are people who were almost killed in combat and others who went through cancer, while still believing in God. That is not to say that your problems are not any more difficult— far be it for me to say that, especially since I do not even know what you are suffering through.
You are a reasonable person, so I believe that you may return to the Faith again in God’s good time. Hopefully your problems get better, and I pray to God that they will.
Thanks for the response, and btw, I am a man.
I know my way around "alone," better than most. Except that I wasn't alone - My God allows for that.
The cynic (which I am) has a harder time with the world, and all that goes wrong in it, because he is ever looking from a pessimistic angle. It is all too easy to see the Hitlers of the world, and miss the promise of the first crocus of spring.
I too, live in a spectacular place - In the midst of the soaring cathedrals of the Rockies... But for many, many years, I paid them no mind... Baby needs new shoes, and all that. It was only when I became so ill that I knew in my heart that I would never again walk off into those hills that I began to remember their beauty and long for what I no longer could do.
It is true: You don't know what you've got until it's gone...
Thankfully, YHWH has blessed me with healing, and it is no longer a thing I cannot grasp - It is a long road ahead, but I will walk those mountains once more... And my perspective of what it is that is important in life is forever changed.
It is harder for you, as you have (had) a papist perspective (IIRC) of what YHWH is. Throw that all upon the altar, get out your Bible, start with Gen 1:1, and read it through. What burns up on the altar was never true to begin with, and what is left is more precious than anything. I will pray that He opens your eyes and gives you understanding.
Look for Him. He is there.
Seems to me that is not for you to decide. It is the Spirit who sanctions, and i know Oneness followers, as well as Adventist followers who can demonstrate the Spirit is with them (whole churches).
And by what standard do you judge your brothers? The Westminster Confession? What they believe may not be true, but then, which faith these days IS true? None. Not one. All have some heresies, either learned from Rome, or made up on their own. Which sin is greater than another?
Show me in the Bible where these criteria are laid upon believers of Yeshua. They are the criteria of men.
Remember, for some meat, for others, milk...
Nice side-step of the issue. The fact is that these oneness pentecostals believe that you can lose your salvation which means they believe you can work to your salvation. False teachings. Do you believe in this works-based salvation?
not likely both of these demonstrate works based salvation and are false religions. All of these are not Christian, neither are the gay churchs. Most churches are not Christian to some extent, whether Methodist or RCC or Pentecostal or Lutheran or Baptist or other. In such large denominations, the word is contaminated. All these latter are failing, but the Oneness pentecostal, Jehovah's witnesses, adventists, mormons etc. are utter distortions of scripture.
The people in these false denominations have their souls in danger.
I go by what I see. Their fruits are what I judge them by, as the Scripture says to do.
both of these demonstrate works based salvation and are false religions.
Yet you would include the papists among the faithful (extraordinary in an OPC Presbyterian), who follow the same route, and indeed are the most famous for it... In fact, more so, as you derive your thought on the others only by their interpretation of sola fide (which, by and large, they do adhere to.
[...] neither are the gay churchs.
Different story. The apostate protestants do not follow Christ - Again, judging them by their fruits.
[...] but [...] Jehovah's witnesses, [...] mormons etc. are utter distortions of scripture.
Mormonism follows its prophet, adds to the Book, and is surely false. Jehovah's Witnesses place their tradition on an equal standing with the Word, much like the papists do (and again, it astounds me that you would include Rome among the faithful).
The people in these false denominations have their souls in danger.
Perhaps it is best to look to the board in one's own eye...
No, the RCC, pentecostals, unitarians are all false religions.
They believe that we Christians who worship on Sunday bear the mark of Cain
They believe the revelation and inspiration of both the Bible and Ellen White's writings to be of equal quality.
Ellen G. White wrote in Patriarchs and Prophets, page 761, "...He (Jesus) was revealed to them as the Angel of Jehovah, the Captain of the Lord's Host, Michael the Archangel".
The Adventist prophet Ellen G White wrote that 'Those who are living on the earth when the intercession of Christ shall cease in the sanctuary above are to stand in the sight of a holy God without a mediator'
She also wrote that "...so Christ will place all these sins upon Satan, the originator and instigator of sin...so Satan, bearing the guilt of all the sins which he has caused God's people to commit, will be for a thousand years confined to the earth, which will then be desolate..."
How can you still believe this to be anything but a cult pretending to be Christian like the Mormons?
Whatever criteria you are using is not Biblical, and thereby, false... good night.
They reject the Westminster Confession of Faith which says: "In the unity of the Godhead there be three persons, of one substance, power, and eternity: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost."
In Oneness, one is sanctified only initially by salvation, but then we must work for our holiness by wearing the right clothes, avoiding all things worldly. Salvation by works
They believe in the false doctrine of baptismal regeneration
They believe that speaking in tongues is the only sign of being saved.
Yes they are not as devilish as the Adventists, but close.
I’m turning in myself. good night and may God guide you to a real Bible believing church and save you from these false denominations
That is rather strongly worded. I am OPC Presbyterian, and I have spent many a day of fellowship with my SDA friends. And I am a sabbatarian who disagrees with YOU for not obeying the commandment of YHWH to observe the Sabbath, and who also disagrees with THEM for gathering together on the Sabbath Day.
They believe the revelation and inspiration of both the Bible and Ellen White's writings to be of equal quality.
Baloney. I wholly agree with you wrt Hellen White, and hold their elevation of her as a prophetess against them. But by my experience, they do *not* hold her prophecies to be equal to the Word. In fact, this has been a common argument between us.
IMO, It would do you good to have a conversation with the folks you so readily condemn.
The adventists DO hold White's prophecies to be equal to scripture. They made this statement in their "Ministry" Magazine of Oct. 1981 and have never retracted it: "We believe the revelation and inspiration of both the Bible and Ellen White's writings to be of equal quality. The superintendence of the Holy Spirit was just as careful and thorough in one case as in the other".
They won't tell you too much about Ellen G. White at their public seminars, but their goal is to bring the person attending to the point of conversion and baptism. Their 2000 baptismal certificate poses questions to which the candidate must answer "yes". Question 8 says,
"Do you accept the biblical teaching of spiritual gifts and believe that the gift of prophecy is one of the identifying marks of the remnant church".
If the candidate says "yes" and is baptised, they soon learn that the "gift of prophecy" is Ellen G. White's writings. Point 13 has them accepting that the SDA Church is the remnant church of Bible Prophecy
These are a cult and you going with them puts your soul in danger.
So what? The Westminster Confession is not holy. It is a document of men, as is the concept of trinity. Show me in the Bible where these beliefs are required in order to follow Yeshua.
In Oneness, one is sanctified only initially by salvation, but then we must work for our holiness by wearing the right clothes, avoiding all things worldly. Salvation by works
Again, SO WHAT? Show me in the BIBLE where Sola Fide is a required belief in order to follow Yeshua (psst! It isn't there).
They believe in the false doctrine of baptismal regeneration.
Like ALL Pentecostals, the regenerational baptism is The Baptism of Fire (the Holy Spirit) which IS correct.
They believe that speaking in tongues is the only sign of being saved.
So? At least they have a Biblical reason for their beliefs
Presbyterians believe in Infant Baptism which isn't Biblical, Replacement Theology, which CERTAINLY isn't Biblical, and in exclusive predestination, which also is not Biblical.
!!!TRADITIONS!!! of men, all of them, without standing in the Word. As I said before, Look to the board in your own eye.
Nuts! I spend no time preaching to the choir. The Apostles spoke to sinners. So will I. ALWAYS. If your soul is THAT fragile, best stay up on the porch.
I am a 5 solas guy, TULIP (with reservations), and basically trinitarian...
These things are supposed to be a light unto the world, not a cudgel to beat folks with. That is what offends me. Using them as an exclusionary device, rather than a light, is the same spirit which caused Rome to murder her millions.
So if I make light of Westminster, or any other doctrine, creed, or confession, it is specifically to show how exclusionary they are. That is *not* their purpose. And they are *NOT* the obligatory things required BY CHRIST to be called one of His followers (ie: Christian), which things Quix laid out perfectly.
Christ never meant for folks to be lead to Him by a ring in their noses.
Well, since others have been slapped down for it, someone has got to do it now.
For someone who claims to be as familiar with the RF as wpacon claims to be, he sure missed that one.
wpacon, the answer is in my posting history. You want to know where I stand on issues, read it.
To have Christian unity, you have to have Christians...Your religion, like the Mormons, believe you must do good works along with your faith so that someday you MIGHT receive salvation...
I could not unite with any religionist that believes that...
Oh?
What reply numbers are they; as I must have missed them.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.