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To: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus
>> Jesus wasn’t a Nazirite. << I didn't SAY he was a Nazarite. I said he would be CALLED a Nazarite. Even if we don't use the evidence of Matthew 2, he still is obviously compared to John the Baptist, he still atones for other sins, and that still negates the objections of those who cite 1 Cor, so the basics hold up.

>> He was the Branch (netser), which is the play on words Matthew is employing. <<

Not buying it. However, I did find something cool about natsar in looking up your assertion. One source says that it means "watcher," which has cool associations with the Book of Enoch... I'm checking into it.

52 posted on 03/04/2011 7:31:35 AM PST by dangus
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To: dangus
Not buying it. However, I did find something cool about natsar in looking up your assertion. One source says that it means "watcher," which has cool associations with the Book of Enoch... I'm checking into it.

Well, whether you personally choose to "buy" it or not is irrelevant.

Jesus was not a Nazarite. He drank products of the vine - and the passover ritual is not the ritual that allowed him to do so, per Numbers 6. Instead, for Jesus to have been a Nazarite, and then have finished his vow, and thus be able to partake of wine, He would need to have shaved his head. He would also have needed to bring a lamb, a ram, and a basket of unleavened bread to the priests at the temple as an offering, and then had the priest make a wave offering of the shoulder of the ram and some of the unleavened bread before Him. Then, he could have drank fruit of the vine. Obviously, we see nothing of the kind happening, so the blithe assumption that "Jesus was a Nazarite, except He drank wine ritually" is simply an unsupported assumption.

Also, if Jesus were a Nazarite, he would not have raised Lazarus or the widow of Nain's son from the dead, because one of the laws of the Nazarite was that they could not "come at" a dead body - which basically means to be in the presence of or in the same place as a dead body - not just that He couldn't *touch* one. I suppose that the raising of the daughter of Jairus from the dead could have been accomplished on a technicality.

We can be pretty sure in saying that Matthew is making the "netser" play on words because that is wholly in line with the Messianic emphasis of Matthew's whole passage, and indeed Matthew's whole gospel, which highlight's the "kingly" aspects of Christ. He cites several OT prophecies about the Messiah, right in a row, and the "Nazarene" one is right in the middle. Context says Matthew is making a play on words involving Isaiah 11:1. The purpose and thrust of the gospel says he is doing so. So, there's no reason to try to read in some unsubstantiated and acontextual stuff about Jesus being a Nazarite.

While the root verb "natsar" does have a meaning associated with "watchers," I don't think it's in the Book of Enoch sense of the term (which, in the Scripture, would correspond more closely to the Aramaic term 'iyr that appears in Daniel twice). Natsar, when translated as "keeper, watchmen" etc. always has the meaning of a purely human person who is guarding something (i.e. a city wall, etc.)

While watching and guarding may be an overtone of Messiah's role (especially in the sense of Messiah as a teacher of the nation, in which case He is watching and guarding the Word of God), the particular form "netser" as it appears in Isaiah 11:1 and three other places - in messianic prophecies - refers to a branch or green shoot. This etymology for this noun probably comes from the secondary sense of the root natsar, which involved one sense of guarding as "guarding vineyards" (itself having interesting messianic applications), hence comes the reference to the green shoots associated with sprouting vines - this is something suggested by the Arabic cognate to this verb, at least.

71 posted on 03/04/2011 8:07:06 AM PST by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (When evolution is outlawed, only outlaws will believe in abject nonsense.)
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