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To: CynicalBear
Lousy attempt to sidetrack the conversation. I give you Ephesians (the Church is built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets), 1 Timothy (the Church of the living God is the pillar and foundation of truth)and Matthew 16 (the bestowing of the keys to Heaven to Peter) in order to lay out the authority.

You go off into some tirade about the Rock. I will quote my conclusion:

The keys are the final clue. Kings in those times gave the keys to the kingdom to their chief steward who looked after the day to day affairs for them. If the king went on a journey, the steward looked after the kingdom for him until he returned. Thus it is with the Church. They have the God-given authority, as Scripture affirms. The children of the Reformation do not.

And I will reaffirm what Scripture points out. Jesus gave the Church His authority on Earth. The children of the Reformation have none.

536 posted on 02/23/2011 2:40:24 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: MarkBsnr

>> I give you Ephesians (the Church is built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets),<<

Ephesians 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

Nothing about Peter being the rock nor the pope there. Jesus is the cornerstone.

1 Cor. 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Hmm. Seems Paul would disagree about your concept of the foundation.

Check this site: http://www.angelfire.com/in/HisName/foundationtwo.html

Misconception #1—Apostles, along with Prophets, Are the Foundation of the Church.

This is probably the most serious misconception and is based on a faulty reading of Eph. 2:20 where Paul tells the Ephesian believers that they are being built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets . . .. In the Greek, “apostles and prophets” is in the genitive case, the case which shows possession. It is like saying “the car of John Doe.” Although the car and John Doe are related, it does not follow that the car is John Doe or that John Doe is the car.

In the same way, it does not follow that the foundation is identical with the apostles and prophets or that the apostles and prophets are identical with the foundation. Paul is actually referring to the foundation which is laid by the apostles and prophets as is borne out in his 1st letter to the Corinthian Church; a church he, as an apostle, had founded.

In 1 Cor. 3:10-11, Paul refers to his founding of the church at Corinth and says, I have laid the foundation and another builds on it. What foundation did Paul lay for the church in Corinth? He says in vs. 11, For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid which is Jesus Christ. The foundation of the apostle Paul in Corinth was Jesus Christ.

>> The keys are the final clue.<<

An in Matthew 18 Jesus gave the keys and power to all the apostles.


550 posted on 02/23/2011 4:03:13 PM PST by CynicalBear
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