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Is It Unbiblical to Protest Against Unrighteous Governments?
American Vision ^
| February 22, 2011
| Gary DeMar
Posted on 02/22/2011 10:28:33 AM PST by topcat54
Who would have thought that the Berlin Wall would come down, or the Soviet Union would collapse, or atheistic Romania and other Eastern Bloc countries would break free from the Soviet orbit? The question is, What will fill the vacuum? If Christians arent ready to lead in this area, then were going to have years of unrest. Until Christians engage the culture in a comprehensive way with the whole purpose God (Acts 20:27) all were going to see in the next few decades is hand wringing. We need a new generation of the sons of Isaachar, men who understood the times with knowledge of what Israel should do (1 Chron. 12:32).
(Excerpt) Read more at americanvision.org ...
TOPICS: Current Events; Theology
KEYWORDS: civilunrest; government
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"Here is where I have a disagreement with MacArthur. The article reports the following about his views: But from a biblical perspective, MacArthur maintained that the protesters are in violation of the biblical command to submit to the powers that be because theyre ordained of God. I dont see how protesting the actions of a civil government is a violation of the biblical command to submit to civil authority. When a civil ruler operates outside his jurisdictional limitations, it is not wrong for the people to call him to account. A civil ruler only operates legitimately in those things over which he has jurisdictional authority. He cant claim that because hes a king that whatever he does is the result of his office. An elected official that lies, cheats, steals, and murders is not doing Gods will in his civil capacity. He can and should be called to account. Samuel Rutherfords comments in
Lex, Rex, or, The Law and the Prince are helpful on this point:
It is true, so long as kings remain kings, subjection is due to them because [they are] kings; but that is not the question. The question is, if subjection be due to them, when they use their power unlawfully and tyrannically. The question is, if subjection be due them when they use their power unlawfully and tyrannically. Whatever David did, though he was a king, he did it not as a king; he deflowered not Bathsheba as king, and Bathsheba might with bodily resistance and violence lawfully have resisted king David, though kingly power remained in him, while he should thus attempt to commit adultery; else David might have said to Bathsheba, Because I am the Lords anointed, it is rebellion in thee, a subject, to oppose any bodily violence to my act of forcing of thee; it is unlawful to thee to cry for help, for if any shall offer violently to rescue thee from me, he resisteth the ordinance of God.[1]
"What if Uriah, Bathshebas husband had learned of his wifes infidelity and the sinful and criminal action of King David? Was he obligated to remain silent and be subject to the kings actions based on MacArthurs reading of Romans 13:12?:"
1
posted on
02/22/2011 10:28:38 AM PST
by
topcat54
To: HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg; Lee N. Field; Gamecock; ReformedBeckite; Alex Murphy; RJR_fan; ...
2
posted on
02/22/2011 10:31:06 AM PST
by
topcat54
("Dispensationalism -- an error of Biblical proportions.")
To: topcat54
Check out what the Greneva Bible 1599 says about Romans 13:12. The KJV was written by King Jim’s boys so it has a “devine right of kings” slant to it.
To: topcat54
Interesting discussion. My gut reaction is Bathsheba could have and perhaps, depending on the situation, should have resisted. Maybe she did resist, I don’t know.
Scripture is clear to me on the point that we are to resist the civil magistrate if commanded to sin. Even to the point of death.
But what if we are just being sinned against? That is a tough one.
For example, if the government decided that they want 80% of my income in tax off the top, should I pay it? They aren’t forcing me to sin, although they are sinning against me.
4
posted on
02/22/2011 10:39:34 AM PST
by
Persevero
(Homeschooling for Excellence since 1992)
To: topcat54
I’ve been so annoyed by a lot of Christians who reference Romans 13 and say “Well, God appoints our leaders, so I don’t need to vote”.
The irony is that the more you accept that we have no position to resist evil government, the less and less it appears as a God-appointed government.
5
posted on
02/22/2011 10:44:28 AM PST
by
MNDude
To: topcat54
"An elected official that lies, cheats, steals, and murders is not doing Gods will in his civil capacity. He can and should be called to account."Agreed.
However, what happens when it's a democratic society that is choosing wrong in free elections? Whether it's electing socialists or electing those who continue to allow abortion, etc. If the people have means of redress through free elections but won't use it. What then?
6
posted on
02/22/2011 10:47:32 AM PST
by
DannyTN
To: US Navy Vet
I have a second minor in New Testament Greek. By no means does that make me a Greek scholar, but I have taken your words back to the original language. Romans 13:1-2 says exactly what this poster disagrees with: That God expects Christians to abide by the tenant of being obedient to the civil authorities, even keeping in mind that this was written at a time when a Christian could be beheaded.
I respect this brother's right to disagree with Dr. MacArthur, but when Dr. MacArthur bases his counsel on Scripture, I have to stand with Dr. MacArthur
Some always pull out the thoughts of Acts 4:19-20 to justify civil disobedience. The riots which are discussed here are not about keeping silent rather than preach and teach the Gospel. The riots are about civil disobedience. The Bible always notes that God is not happy with rebellion. Rebellion is in the domain of Satan.
I'm not saying that obedience to an ungodly authority is easy or without suffering, but the Scriptures make it clear that it is God who will handle and judge those matters. Those exercising ungodly authority will answer to Him.
7
posted on
02/22/2011 10:57:58 AM PST
by
righttackle44
(I may not be much, but I raised a U.S. Marine.)
To: topcat54
America's Providential History
This should be required for every US citizen. An aside here - Recently my son told me all the founding fathers were atheist - they've gone from deist to atheist now. I took about 5 minutes and read him some quotes from here and he hasn't brought it up again.
To: topcat54
Well done. Keep up the good work.
9
posted on
02/22/2011 11:07:02 AM PST
by
the_conscience
(We ought to obey God, rather than men. (Acts 5:29b))
To: topcat54
I would suggest anyone interested in this issue read Francis Schaeffer’s “A Christian Manifesto”. The book analyzes this issue extensively.
To: DannyTN
However, what happens when it's a democratic society that is choosing wrong in free elections? Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's ...
In a democratic or republican form of government, "We, the People" are Caesar.
Our responsibility is twofold:
1) To reprimand our elected representatives when they work ungodliness in our name
2) To persuade our fellow citizens that they must use their authority (in the voting booth, in the jury box, etc) in a Godly manner.
We citizens of a Republic would have no authority if it were not granted us by God.
11
posted on
02/22/2011 11:29:02 AM PST
by
ArrogantBustard
(Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
To: righttackle44
The Bible always notes that God is not happy with rebellion. Amen.
To Hell with that ungodly rebel George Washington, and all his demonic followers!
Um ....
Right?
12
posted on
02/22/2011 11:31:38 AM PST
by
ArrogantBustard
(Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
To: ArrogantBustard
Your argument is not with me. Your argument is with what God says in Scripture. Regardless of your apparent immaturity.
13
posted on
02/22/2011 11:37:00 AM PST
by
righttackle44
(I may not be much, but I raised a U.S. Marine.)
To: circlecity
While Schaeffer was helpful, he had his issues as well. Because he was not fully engaged with biblical law as the basis for a just society, he bounced between the extreme views of capitulation and resistance.
Unfortunately, Schaeffer left behind an unfinished legacy. He knew where the answer was, but he was unable, within the confines of his own methodology and his premillennial eschatology, to see it through. Its a shame that Schaeffer will best be remembered for his advocation of Christian resistance and not Christian reconstruction. See Not Willing to Go Far Enough.
14
posted on
02/22/2011 11:38:33 AM PST
by
topcat54
("Dispensationalism -- an error of Biblical proportions.")
To: righttackle44
Your argument is not with me. Your argument is with what God says in Scripture. Really?
So what do you think?
Was George Washington a Godly Hero of Liberty or a damned godless rebel against God's ordained ruler?
15
posted on
02/22/2011 11:40:47 AM PST
by
ArrogantBustard
(Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
To: ArrogantBustard
He is an American hero.
He and the American Fathers will
have to answer to God for fomenting
rebellion, against the counsel of Scripture.
Now, you tell me: what do YOU say on the
authority of Scripture? And what do you say
about the statements of Scripture that you
will answer for yourself before God one day?
16
posted on
02/22/2011 11:56:51 AM PST
by
righttackle44
(I may not be much, but I raised a U.S. Marine.)
To: righttackle44
He is an American hero. That's nice. Maximilien François Marie Isidore de Robespierre was a Hero of "Liberte, Egalite, et Fraternite.
Both of them were rebels.
Somebody on this thread asserted "The Bible always notes that God is not happy with rebellion. Rebellion is in the domain of Satan."
He and the American Fathers will have to answer to God for fomenting rebellion, against the counsel of Scripture.
OK ... so what do you say? Were they wrong to foment rebellion? Would a hypothetical "we", in the present day, be wrong to "foment rebellion" against a government which behaved similarly to the government of King George III?
Your final paragraph is a colossal irrelevancy.
17
posted on
02/22/2011 12:10:22 PM PST
by
ArrogantBustard
(Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
To: topcat54
Well, I very much part ways with Demar on his analysis of Schaeffer on this point and after reading his article I find it hard to believe he actually read the Schaeffer works he references. My bet is he just read a wikipedia type article about Schaeffer. In any event, his biggest gripe seems to be that Schaeffer doesn't agree with Gary Demar. I found this quote amusing:
"Schaeffer rightly decried a de facto sociological lawlaw based only on what the majority of society thinks is in its best interests at a given momentbut offered no worked-out worldview to counter and replace it."
This is laughable in that virtually all of Schaeffer's work was an extensive polemic against a humanist worldview contrasted with a detailed, "worked-out", comprehensive Christian worldview Schaeffer saw as the biblical alternitive. This is particularly true of "The God who is There" and "Escape from Reason". Schaeffer was the father of the modern "Christian worldview" movement and his entire legacy is a testament to the worldview Demar claims he failed to offer. Stick to eschatology Gary.
To: ArrogantBustard
You didn't answer my question: What do YOU think about
Scripture saying you will answer for your actions. I don't
accept your proposition that it is irrelevant. It is
the most important question you will ever answer. Trying
to avoid it simply shows where you are. Trying to avoid it
now does not mean you will will never have to answer it.
19
posted on
02/22/2011 1:09:18 PM PST
by
righttackle44
(I may not be much, but I raised a U.S. Marine.)
To: circlecity
This is laughable in that virtually all of Schaeffer's work was an extensive polemic against a humanist worldview contrasted with a detailed, "worked-out", comprehensive Christian worldview Schaeffer saw as the biblical alternitive. In your opinion, what exactly was Schaeffers worldview in terms of the civil magistrate?
20
posted on
02/22/2011 1:12:19 PM PST
by
topcat54
("Dispensationalism -- an error of Biblical proportions.")
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