Pope includes Hindu verses in prayers on Good Friday

merinews ^ | Apr 14, 2009

[conservativegramma]

And what makes it even funnier is when deniers of Christ's words just publish snippets of anti-Catholicism that they found on the internet.

As opposed to snippets of anti-protestantism found on Catholic Apologetic sites? I'm not the one elevating a magisterium ABOVE Christ. YOU ARE. Be careful that projection thing is showing again.

[RnMomof7]

Wow Excellent post !!!

I would only complain that conservative Presbyterians were lumped in with PCUSA heretics.. I can say with some confidence that in my church not one member would say Jesus sinned.. maybe 10 or 15 % of casual attenders..

The information you give is awesome..I am going to “steal it” :)

[RnMomof7]

That’s funny coming from a Catholic to criticize you for *cutting and pasting*.

***GRIN**

[conservativegramma]

I’ve had two posts deleted, apparently I erred and posted information from a ‘forbidden’ source. My bad.

On the other hand these posts remain without chastisement:

#363 where Cronos stated, “Why do you worship Satan?” and

#365 where Cronos posted an image suggesting my Pastor is a satanic snake handler and

Post #366 where Cronos asks, “And how's the new group symbol coming on since your group rejected the cross?” Then:

#367where I’m told, ‘do stop repeating the lie’ and: #372 where I’m snidely lumped in with Anton LeVay with the statement, “The problem is that many people are completely taken up by Anton LeVay and then deny Christ.”

FR religion forum rules state: “On all threads, but particularly “open” threads, posters must never “make it personal.” Reading minds and attributing motives are forms of “making it personal.”

I’m not sure how any of the above doesn’t violate the rules of making it personal, or for that matter trying to provoke a flame war, but apparently those statements and actions are allowed. But posting a picture from a forbidden site is not. Oh well, I’ll take it as a complement Cronos needed to resort to those tactics, it is what it is.

Since I still believe it is not the position of FR to have a privileged membership list where some are given special rights to violate the rules and others are not; therefore, I still believe as well that FR will allow me a position of self-defense when accused of being a Satanist. If I'm wrong and this post is pulled while the above posts remain, then it will be apparent there is a privilged class of FR members.

So I will post the same pic from a CATHOLIC site that is not on any forbidden lists (as I assume that would be allowed):

A gentle reminder to Cronos regarding my ‘Satanism’ – My church’s cross is rightside up. Yours is upside down. Enough said.

[Pyro7480]

LOL! You’re going to have to do better than that. The vast majority of crucifixes/crosses in Catholic churches/contexts are in the right orientation. The upside-down is sometimes used in the papal context NOT for the Satanic reason, but because St. Peter was CRUCIFIED UPSIDE-DOWN.

[conservativegramma]

LOL indeed. So its okay with you for your church to use a satanic symbol??? (Doesn't matter how often - sheez - once is enough!)

Papal context? Satanic symbols are okay in a papal context?

Wow. You're going to have to do better than using the Peter example, that's just the most ridiculous spin I've ever heard. Holy cow. Oh geez - sorry - shouldn't have used that expression, you might be using bovine symbols next.

[Judith Anne]

From wikipedia:

The origin of this symbol comes from the Catholic tradition that Simon Peter was crucified upside down, as told by Origen of Alexandria. The tradition first appears in the “Martyrdom of Peter”, a fragmented text found in, but likely predating, the apocryphal Acts of Peter, which was written no later than 200 A.D. It is believed that Peter requested this form of crucifixion as he felt he was unworthy to be crucified in the same manner that Christ died (upright). As such, some Catholics use this cross as a symbol of humility and unworthiness in comparison to Christ.

According to Roman Catholicism, the Pope is Peter’s successor as Bishop of Rome. Therefore the Papacy is often represented by symbols that are also used to represent Peter — one example being the Keys of Heaven, another the Petrine Cross. During Pope John Paul II’s visit to Israel, he sat on a chair with the Cross of Peter cut into the back.[1]

The inverted cross is also one of the traditional symbols used by Petrine Orthodox Sebomenoi.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_of_St._Peter

[Judith Anne]

Wow. You're going to have to do better than using the Peter example, that's just the most ridiculous spin I've ever heard. Holy cow. Oh geez - sorry - shouldn't have used that expression, you might be using bovine symbols next.

Surely you are not one of those ignorant people who repeat every falsehood they happen to see...

[metmom]

A gentle reminder to Cronos regarding my ‘Satanism’ – My church’s cross is rightside up. Yours is upside down. Enough said.

OUCH!!!!

[metmom]

Boggles the mind what Catholics will justify in their church’s actions, does it not?

I have noticed that there is virtually NOTHING which a catholic will not defend somehow as long as it is THEIR church which does it.

Rather telling, is it not?

[conservativegramma]

None of which is biblical. From your link: "It [St. Peter's Cross] has also often become associated with Satanic and anti-religious attitudes, as it is considered to represent the opposite of Christianity by inverting its primary symbol, the Latin Cross. As a result, this symbol has become very popular within anti-religion groups and among some extreme metal musicians, notably black metal and death metal ones."

Which brings us back to the point: My church doesn't use anything that smacks in any way of satanism despite Cronos' accusations. I would think you guys would do better. But I guess not.

[conservativegramma]

Surely you are not one of those ignorant people who repeat every falsehood they happen to see...

Nah. I usually ignore the Vatican.

[conservativegramma]

I have noticed that there is virtually NOTHING which a catholic will not defend somehow as long as it is THEIR church which does it. Rather telling, is it not?

Me too and AMEN!

[Judith Anne]

That quote is incomplete. It goes on to explain that the inverted cross is considered satanic by heavy metal aficionados and Satan worshippers. It is particularly offensive when it is a crucifix, as in some films, “The Exorcism of Emily Rose” or “The Exorcist.”

I do not consider the (inverted) Petrine Cross to be satanic, as do the heavy metal fans and satan worshippers. Which category do you fall into?

[Judith Anne]

Actually, the Petrine Cross comes from a scrap of Origen’s writings. Didn’t you quote Origen, or was that someone else? If you did, do you only believe PARTS of what you quote, or all?

[Judith Anne]

Never mind. I don’t want to know. People who are bigots are ultimately very dull, and I have more interesting things to do than sit and read lame remarks.

[conservativegramma]

I fall into the camp that makes Jesus Christ the focus - not symbols - of any kind. Nor graven images - of any kind. The same camp Irenaeus and other church fathers was in:

Others of them employ outward marks, branding their disciples inside the lobe of the right ear. From among these also arose Marcellina, who came to Rome under [the episcopate of] Anicetus, and, holding these doctrines, she led multitudes astray. They style themselves Gnostics. They also possess images, some of them painted, and others formed from different kinds of material; while they maintain that a likeness of Christ was made by Pilate at that time when Jesus lived among them. They crown these images, and set them up along with the images of the philosophers of the world that is to say, with the images of Pythagoras, and Plato, and Aristotle, and the rest. They have also other modes of honouring these images, after the same manner of the Gentiles.” -Irenaeus, Against Heresies 1.25.6

But it is clear to every one that piety, which teaches to worship and honour, is the highest and oldest cause; and the law itself exhibits justice, and teaches wisdom, by abstinence from sensible images, and by inviting to the Maker and Father of the universe.” -Clement ofAlexandria, The Stromata 2.18

So we would now make a remark about the arts of the theatre, about the things also whose authors in the names we execrate. We know that the names of the dead are nothing, as are their images; but we know well enough, too, who, when images are set up, under these names carry on their wicked work, and exult in the homage rendered to them, and pretend to be divine-none other than spirits accursed, than devils.” -Tertullian, The Shows 10

Exodus 20:4 - You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth.

John 4:24 - God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.

[conservativegramma]

People who are bigots are ultimately very dull,

Are you speaking of anti-protestant bigots or anti-catholic bigots, or both, or...nevermind. If a personal attack is your best rebuttal I'll accept that as a complement.

[Judith Anne]

Oh, so you are a real authority, eh? Pardon me, it did not appear that you could be...

Now, I’ve always wondered, what do you do about those darn photos...? I mean, I have many photos of my deceased husband that I love to look at occasionally, and occasionally, I kiss the photo, and sometimes press them to my heart, along with his letters to me....And Exodus says make no image of what is in heaven or on earth, etc. AM I WORSHIPPING AN IDOL????? You appear to know it ALL, please tell me...WHERE DO I DRAW THE LINE???????