Changes in who eternal life is offered to:
Alma is the longest book in the Book of Mormon, and right up front it teaches universalism -- that all will be saved. Hasn't that ever caught your spirit? I mean, c'mon, if Alma 1:4 is true, why bother with the Mormon missionary and genealogical enterprise systems?
"And he also testified unto the people that ALL MANKIND SHOULD BE SAVED AT THE LAST DAY, and that they need not fear nor tremble, but that they might lift up their heads and rejoice; for the Lord had created all men, and has also redeemed all men; and, in the end, ALL MEN SHOULD HAVE ETERNAL LIFE" (Alma 1:4)
Less than a year before the Book of Mormon was published, Joseph Smith was still wrestling with "gift of eternal life" or keeping commandments gets you eternal life:
Q. "Joe, is eternal life a gift -- or something you have to work toward by way of commandment keeping?"
A. [Yes]
Follow-up comment: "Joe, that's not a yes-no question"
A. "...if you keep my commandments and endure to the end you shall have eternal life, which gift is the greatest of all the gifts of God." (June, 1829 D&C 14:7)
Yet Joseph kept answering those multiple-choice questions with a "yes" answer. Other examples:
Q. "Joe, do ALL men need to repent?"
A. "Wherefore, I will that ALL men shall repent..." (March, 1831 D&C 49:8)
Q. "Joe, are ALL men 'under sin' or MOST men?"
A. [Yes] "Wherefore, I will that ALL men shall repent, for all men are under sin, except those which I have reserved unto myself, holy men that ye know not of." (March, 1831, D&C 49:8)
Follow-up comment: "Joe, that's not a yes-no question! Besides, you just contradicted your answer to my previous question! I asked if 'ALL men were under sin?' And you said all needed to repent. Then you said there were 'except[ions]' to men being 'under sin' -- which if they weren't under sin, why the need for 'ALL men to repent?' Is it all or most?"
The English language dictates that if "ALL" wasn't even in the equation, why carelessly bring it into the conversation? (Especially if that's God talking)
Q. "Joe, is anybody allowed after you receive commandments and revelations in this church?"
A. "...behold, verily I say unto thee, NO ONE shall be appointed to receive commandments and revelations in this church excepting my servant Joseph Smith, Jun., for he receiveth them even as Moses...thou shalt not write by way of commandment, but by wisdom; (Sept. 1830, D&C 28:2,5)
First of all, note "shall be appointed" is a future-tense prophecy. Second any further "revelations," Smith seems to say, can't be relayed as having come as "commandments" from God. Mormon, what good is that "living prophet" you tout if he can only coax people by exposition of "wisdom" -- and NOT by passing any new God's commandments? If you think such a newer "prophet" can reveal new commandments, guess what? You are labeling Joseph Smith a "false prophet" based upon his words form D&C 28!
Finally...was Adam & Eve's sin a good thing (opened door to parenthood & godhood, per Mormonism) or a bad thing (opened door to rebellion, sin, disobedience, generational fall, etc., per Christianity)?
If the Mormon version goes, then what "fall" was that? "Fall" shouldn't even be in the Mormon language. Yet...it is...in fact, the fall was so bad, per the Book of Mormon, that you and I -- no matter what our church heritage is -- needs redemption. Elsewise, why would Ether say:
"Because thou knowest these things ye are redeemed from the fall..." (Ether 3:13)
Alma is the longest book in the Book of Mormon, and right up front it teaches universalism — that all will be saved. Hasn’t that ever caught your spirit? I mean, c’mon, if Alma 1:4 is true, why bother with the Mormon missionary and genealogical enterprise systems?
“And he also testified unto the people that ALL MANKIND SHOULD BE SAVED AT THE LAST DAY, and that they need not fear nor tremble, but that they might lift up their heads and rejoice; for the Lord had created all men, and has also redeemed all men; and, in the end, ALL MEN SHOULD HAVE ETERNAL LIFE” (Alma 1:4)
Hi Colofornian,
You don’t seem to realize that Alma 1:4 is citing Nehor — a man among the Nephites who started to teach “what he termed to the word of God”. Nehor is mentioned in Alma because he was a teacher of falsehoods, and the passage you quote is an example of one of his false teachings.
Regards,
Normandy
Seekers of truth,If you peruse the Free Republic religion forums you will notice a pattern. There's an anti-Mormon group of people here that spends a great deal of their time attacking the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They post regurgitated propaganda on an almost daily basis.
They have a misguided obsession. You can witness many different tactics employed that you might find quite interesting. The straw man argument is a big favorite and is frequently preceded by cherry-picking quotes or other material. After the "quotation" the attacker will misrepresent what has been said or what was meant and then attack their own interpretation.Later they will have the audacity to claim they were "only" quoting our own material.
They will of course insist ad nauseum that they are merely using our sources and are therefore innocent of any deceptive practice. LDS persons have no issue whatsoever having our scriptures or leaders quoted as long as it is presented fairly and accurately. This is rarely (if ever) done.
Another favorite is posting scripture or statements which on their own really present no dilemma. They make something out of nothing while never bringing up a single objection that hasn't been addressed a hundred times before.
You might note a couple of other tactics used to try to antagonize is the use of disrespectful or insulting terms or language and/or pictures. That's a Christlike thing to do right? Yeah I don't think so either. It does speak volumes about them though.
Some of them claim being some sort of special witness to you as being supposedly former Mormons. So someone who is an ex-member of any organization would never have an axe to grind or have reason to try to justify their actions by any means? Perhaps not but perhaps so. The LDS Church gains members from other denominations as well as others faiths all the time. This doesn't make them an expert on anything and you certainly won't hear them attacking their forner Church.
Frequently they cruise the headlines of the day seeking any story that might be twisted into making the Church look bad. Anything will do, just watch the progression of posts following it and see what I mean.
After reading their posts, I invite you to seek the truth about whatever "issue" they seem to be "revealing" or "exposing". I promise that if you do so with honest intent, the "ahah" moments you will have will be many and frequent. You will start to recognize the tactics employed to cleverly twist and attack and will likely chuckle the more you see. In actuality, there's nothing new here. It's all been addressed many times before.
The latest twist in the anti-Mormon propaganda machine is to actually go to the links provided, but then they cherry pick what they want, then quote and straw man attack that. Clever. It almost appears that they are helping you, the seeker of truth out by doing some footwork for you. Not so much. Don't be insulted, look for yourself. It's not the haystack they want you to think.
Here's a few links to get your started from a different viewpoint. I have found that the vast majority of the "issues" brought up can be found and addressed at http://www.fairlds.org/ but here's more:
http://scriptures.lds.org/
http://www.lds.org
http://www.fairlds.org/
http://www.mormonapologetics.org/
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Main_Page
http://www.lightplanet.com/response/index.html
http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDS_Intro.shtml
http://www.answeringantimormons.com/index.htm
http://promormon.blogspot.com/
Now you will likely notice the "you never address or answer our points" posts pop up as usual. All after providing the answers just as you have here.
Sometimes it is claimed that these sites present a needle in a haystack. Far from it. But if you give up before you try you won't know will you? They often state that these sites provide no answer. They just don't want you looking. It is as simple as that.
Will you wear blinders too? Seek truth. Find out for yourself. Want to chat with someone on any topic? A few of these sites provide just that. So do your homework sincere seeker of truth. Listen and read from both "sides". Make up your own mind.
I witness to you of these truths and wish you the best, in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Amen.
