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To: Marty62; sola gracia
To believe that Jews will somehow be abandoned by GOD is irrational.

What is irrational is equating God's intention for Jewish people with the land of Israel. God has not abandoned the Jews. The evidence is all around us since countless numbers of Jewish people have come to accept their Messiah Jesus, and have been grafted into the Root. So it's quite obvious that God has not abandoned the Jews nor ever intended to abandon the Jews.

The sad fact is that many people, including Christian people, can't figure that out and keep insisting that God's plan for Jewish people is somehow tied to the land. God's plan was and is to make them into true children of Abraham, and to have the faith of Abraham, who was looking for a heavenly land.

By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going. By faith he dwelt in the land of promise as in a foreign country, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise; for he waited for the city which has foundations, whose builder and maker is God. … But now they desire a better, that is, a heavenly country. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them. (Heb. 11:8-10,16)
The old covenant was a means to an end. It was not an end in itself. The sacrificial system, the priesthood, the temple, and all the ceremonies we types to point us to the Salvation of God, Jesus Christ (Luke 24:27). They were never intended by God to go beyond the time of Messiah.
In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. (Heb. 8:13)
What does “obsolete” mean? Why would God give us a new covenant if He still had plans for the old? Hebrews gives us the answer. It was all passing away once Messiah appeared. It was no longer needed. Now Jews, as well as gentiles, could come to God via the Messiah without the need for the ceremonies of the old covenant.

Do you see the difference, that God has not abandoned the Jewish people? Just changed focus from the nationalistic/cultic religion of the old covenant to the universal “one new man” of the new? Does it make sense?

10 posted on 02/05/2011 7:25:04 PM PST by topcat54 ("Dispensationalism -- an error of Biblical proportions.")
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To: topcat54

I think we are discussing at cross-purposes here. I understand what you are saying. I guess I am focusing on the condition of Man as we speak.
Christ was God on earth. He only had 120 followers at the time of his death. Yet the idols of the Gentiles fell at his feet as the WORD was spread.

My point is that man in his sinfulness has created new idols to replace GOD. Not unlike the Israelites as Moses received the Commandments from GOD.

Will GOD show us the same grace that he showed the Jews? (promised land).
But, it is my thoughts that God was reaching the Gentiles for salvation.
Yet we are now turning our backs on him thru the acceptance of the religion of man.
I do not believe that GOD will not allow this to continue without punishment. It is just a matter of what form the punishment takes.

Will it be 7 years of suffering under the Hell of the Islamists?
Will it be 7 years of natural disasters to bring us to our knees.
I personally believe we are in the end times. That we had better be concerned about our own salvation and exactly why are we as a society willing to accept those things that are an insult to God.


15 posted on 02/05/2011 8:47:57 PM PST by Marty62 (Marty 60)
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To: topcat54

Would you happen to know off the top of your head which scriptures in the Old Testiment specifically contain GODS words regarding the Messiah to come?


16 posted on 02/05/2011 9:02:19 PM PST by Marty62 (Marty 60)
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