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Posted on 01/02/2011 5:46:30 PM PST by Paragon Defender
>...true confession of faith ...
... is the shunning of ALL religion,...You realize there is no ‘true church’
= = = = =
Are you saying that all the people who regularly attend church don’t have a “true confession of faith” ? Do you mean that the thousands who attend (and financially support) mega-churches like the Chrystal Cathedral should instead “shun all” church going?
I don’t think you meant that, did you?
Or did you mean to say that a “true Christian” can go to any church or no church at all...whatever. It doesn’t matter.
Or what did you mean?
No that isn’t what i am saying, and I am sorry it came across that way.
You do know, you do recognize that something is different. And I know several people who have tried faking being a Christian, i was one of them once.
Read John, Romans, Acts, Hebrews. Look at what the Bible says, trust Christ alone for your salvation, REALLY believe and REALLY surrender. That is where it begins.
But you see Charles, I was still a Mormon when I joined FreeRepublic. For several years I posted as a Mormon, though an unbelieving one. One day, one particularly nasty LDS lady told me that I wasn’t allowed to call myself a Mormon since I didn’t regularly attend Church services, and didn’t believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet (she has since been banned from this site).
From that day forward, I was refused the right to post on Mormon caucus threads, simply because I didn’t toe the mark - wasn’t up to snuff when it came to Mormonism. Almost all of the Mormons on this site refused to allow me a say on caucus threads about my Mormonism or my experiences as a Mormon even though I was been born and raised a sixth generation Mormon in Utah and still retained my membership on their rolls.
Now, who gets to decide who can post on a caucus thread? Is it the Religion Mod? Admin Mod? Jim Rob? The poster of the thread?
Mormonism is a devious cult of Christianity. They use control tactics and don’t allow dissension or questions. They bring their accusations of bigotry and hatred to unrelated sites like this and try to control discussions about their theology so only the “good” parts are shown. Is that a Christian way to act? I say it isn’t.
no, church doesn’t matter for the most part. However, Christians need to be in a solid bible believing church and sadly there are too few of them.
Christians go to church for fellowship with other believers and to learn that is all. I know too many people, lds especially, who place their faith in RELIGION (rites rules church membership all that stuff) rather than in Christ.
You can be a Christian (a true Christian) and never step foot into a church, but you won’t grow. However, you can also have your spiritual growth stunted by attending a church that is legalistic or isn’t doctrinally (biblically) sound.
Doctrine matters, but only on the big things - Person work and nature of Christ. That automatically leaves Mormons and JW’s and a few other groups out.
Groups like the LDS claim there is only one ‘true church’, that God founded a denomination. that isn’t true in the least and that is what I meant. The word translated Church (ekklesia), means in the greek ‘an assembly’ or literally the ‘called out ones’. It isn’t about religon, it is about relationship. Christ came to reconcile us to God, not start a denomination. When you get too caught up in belonging to a denomination (church) you can (and often do) lose focus on Christ. That is dangerous indeed.
FWIW, I have attended several churches over the years, all Christian, but I am a member of none of them. Right now, we divide our time between the Lutherans, Methodists, and a non-denom church. For the last several years before we moved, we attended a Calvary Chapel, before that it was a community church, we were married in an EV Free church. All are Christian.
See 965 for an example of DU talking out of both sides of his mouth.
"Answer to above from DU: I'm asking you again, how exactly did you receive your negative message?
What exactly were your preparations for an answer from on high?
Please understand I am not trying to tear you down, but your actions are not consistent with your words here and I as an analyst must either conclude that you have left something vital out of your report, or you have falsified it in some way. I do not like to think that my Christian brethren would lie about something so important to the salvation of the soul, so I ask for more information to help me and any Lurkers to rectify the apparent contradictions of your story with your actions."
Legerdemain is for magicians not preachers.
For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him]. - 2 Cor 11:3-4
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. – John 1:1-4
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all [things] he might have the preeminence. For it pleased [the Father] that in him should all fulness dwell; And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, [I say], whether [they be] things in earth, or things in heaven.– Colossians 1:15-20
Remember the former things of old: for I [am] God, and [there is] none else; [I am] God, and [there is] none like me, Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times [the things] that are not [yet] done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: - Isaiah 46:9-10
Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. - John 8:58
As soon then as he had said unto them, I am [he], they went backward, and fell to the ground. – John 18:6
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. –I Corinthians 12:3
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. - Revelation 1:7-8
I just want to say thank you for pulling this thread out of its ‘caucus’ status and into the light for the rest of us who find the title highly objectionable to be able to comment and refute.
I’ve been of the opinion for some time that many LDS freepers have been using FR as a proslytizing website. When their doctrine is refuted using facts they usually start whining about being ‘bashed’ and ‘hated’. The individual mormon is not hated, but prayed for. The LDS organization/hierarchy is indeed hated as all Christians are commanded to not only hate but refute all false doctrine. There is a difference between the individual caught up in the lie and the false prophets/church by and from whom the individuals are kept deceived.
The responses coming in from Mormons as I am attempting to get caught up in the hundreds of posts so far are proving me to have probably been right in my initial analysis. Thanks Jim.
Amen and worth a repost. You hit the nail on the head:
The individual mormon is not hated, but prayed for. The LDS organization/hierarchy is indeed hated as all Christians are commanded to not only hate but refute all false doctrine. There is a difference between the individual caught up in the lie and the false prophets/church by and from whom the individuals are kept deceived.
WOW...So many posts..Where to begin...
Ok here I go...
You said
Jesus said who do you say I am? Is that Jesus trying to convince other’s of his divinity? he lived his life showing other’s who he was, by his actions, by his healings, by his teachings....
I guess he could of really convinced everyone by raising his hands to heaven and screaming to GOD to shout over the world who he was.....
No I don’t think he was out to CONVINCE other’s who he was by the standards of Man’s proof of GOD....
To the person who asked:
BTT and BTTT and BUMP all mean the same thing. It’s just a way to add a post to the thread, so that the thread will stay somewhere near the top of the list (and thereby be seen by more viewers).
Like this:
BUMP
” Was Joseph Smith a true prophet?”
Based on the “truest” book ever written according to Mormons. No!
The doctrine according to Mormon theology is that Jesus was not God Himself but an older brother to all of us. But according to the BOM it specifically states that it was God himself that came down as Jesus. So naturally when a Christian reads the BOM he finds not too much difference. It is only when you get into their deeper theology that you find bad doctrine. Doctrine that contradicts itself on the most fundamental levels. Such as who is God.
Book of Mormon (Condradicts that Jesus was the OLDER brother)
Mosiah 13:34: “Have they not said that God himself should come down among the children of men, and take upon him the form of man, and go forth in mighty power upon the face of the earth?”
Mosiah 15:1-5: “And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people. And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son— The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son— And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, suffereth temptation...”
Mosiah 16:15: “Teach them that redemption cometh through Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father.”
Alma 11:26-33: And Zeezrom said unto him: Thou sayest there is a true and living God? And Amulek said: Yea, there is a true and living God. Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. Now Zeezrom said unto him again: How knowest thou these things? And he said: An angel hath made them known unto me. And Zeezrom said again: Who is he that shall come? Is it the Son of God? And he said unto him, Yea.”
Alma 11:38-40: Now Zeezrom saith again unto him: Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father? And Amulek said unto him: Yea, he is the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth, and all things which in them are; he is the beginning and the end, the first and the last; And he shall come into the world to redeem his people; and he shall take upon him the transgressions of those who believe on his name; and these are they that shall have eternal life, and salvation cometh to none else.”
In Mosiah it says, “God himself” shall come down among the children of men. “God Himself”. What better words to explain who Jesus is! In Mosiah it also says Jesus is “…Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father”. This isn’t written in another language or in need of further interpretation, but comes from the Book of Mormon – a book proclaimed to be “the most correct book on the face of the earth”! The Book of Mormon – and the Bible – teach there is only one Eternal Father and He is our Father in heaven who is over all, not just ‘over this earth’, but over all that exists and all that will ever exist. Why don’t you believe these verses from the Book of Mormon? If the Book of Mormon is the most correct book on the earth, why doesn’t it say, “Jesus, who is our eternal brother”?
How can the Book of Mormon be the most correct book on the earth when the LDS Church doesn’t accept and teach the above passages? Growing up, I was always taught that the Book of Mormon is “the most correct book on the face of the earth”. I don’t know who originally said that, as far as church history, but I’ve heard this quote or phrase many times. To find out that the Book of Mormon agrees with the Bible on who God is, was like a lightning bolt from the sky. Can you tell me why the LDS Church doesn’t teach this – especially since it is in the Book of Mormon? It doesn’t make sense that your church does not accept it’s own scriptures.
Book of Mormon
Mosiah 13:34: “Have they not said that God himself should come down among the children of men, and take upon him the form of man, and go forth in mighty power upon the face of the earth?”
Mosiah 15:1-5: “And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people. And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son— The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son— And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, suffereth temptation...”
Mosiah 16:15: “Teach them that redemption cometh through Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father.”
Alma 11:26-33: And Zeezrom said unto him: Thou sayest there is a true and living God? And Amulek said: Yea, there is a true and living God. Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. Now Zeezrom said unto him again: How knowest thou these things? And he said: An angel hath made them known unto me. And Zeezrom said again: Who is he that shall come? Is it the Son of God? And he said unto him, Yea.”
Alma 11:38-40: Now Zeezrom saith again unto him: Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father? And Amulek said unto him: Yea, he is the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth, and all things which in them are; he is the beginning and the end, the first and the last; And he shall come into the world to redeem his people; and he shall take upon him the transgressions of those who believe on his name; and these are they that shall have eternal life, and salvation cometh to none else.”
In Mosiah it says, “God himself” shall come down among the children of men. “God Himself”. What better words to explain who Jesus is! In Mosiah it also says Jesus is “…Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father”. This isn’t written in another language or in need of further interpretation, but comes from the Book of Mormon – a book proclaimed to be “the most correct book on the face of the earth”! The Book of Mormon – and the Bible – teach there is only one Eternal Father and He is our Father in heaven who is over all, not just ‘over this earth’, but over all that exists and all that will ever exist. Why don’t you believe these verses from the Book of Mormon? If the Book of Mormon is the most correct book on the earth, why doesn’t it say, “Jesus, who is our eternal brother”?
How can the Book of Mormon be the most correct book on the earth when the LDS Church doesn’t accept and teach the above passages? Growing up, I was always taught that the Book of Mormon is “the most correct book on the face of the earth”. I don’t know who originally said that, as far as church history, but I’ve heard this quote or phrase many times. To find out that the Book of Mormon agrees with the Bible on who God is, was like a lightning bolt from the sky. Can you tell me why the LDS Church doesn’t teach this – especially since it is in the Book of Mormon? It doesn’t make sense that your church does not accept it’s own scriptures.
As anyone familiar with the LDS doctrine you can clearly see that the BOM CONDRADICTS their own theology.
With Judaism and Christianity you could go back and translate out of the original tongues. With Mormonism their is no original tongue except Joseph Smith.
...although it doesn’t seem to be working that way right now.
The original thread is still way, way down the list.
And... it’s back in the Religion category. It’s not in Breaking News anymore.
Hmm...
Can anyone explain to me how this works?
Why isn’t the thread in Breaking News anymore?
Tara,
Are you as naive as you try to portray, or are you just following the script? It is apparent to many of us that you belong to the sect called the Jehovah's Witnesses. If not, please feel free to deny it. For our sake, go away with your little ploy. You fooled a few, but as it was alleged:
"You can fool some of the people all of the time, you can fool all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all people all the time..."
Jesus ran through the temple tossing tables. He taught elders. He may have shouted. It isn't noted.
I would think that God's truly chosen people will always recognize His voice. I do, and I am not part of any 144,000. We have the same promise as the guy next door!
Jesus promised a rest. I'll take His way!
>With Judaism and Christianity you could go back and translate out of the original tongues.
= = = =
No, actually, you can’t. The earliest existing fragments come from the second century (about 125 A.D.).
So we have no way of know exactly what the original New Testament said... and the Old Testament, of course, goes back much, much earlier.
Slanderous? Oh that is choice victimology. Remarkable because I've seen of evidence of any application of those studies in your posts.
Is it your contention that I should spend less time with the KJV and more with the JST? If not, why do you keep bringing it up?
The JST is your prophets corrected kjv is it not - therefore more reliable and correctly translated? Yet you don't cite it here at all. LOL, guess you must consider it spurious just like 'ol bring'em young eh?
“In Satira Veritas”
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