Posted on 12/04/2010 7:03:56 PM PST by pastorbillrandles
The Rolling Stones were the first true rockers to come out England, just months after the Beatles. THEIR early, and even later, music was based in the blues, blues-rock, and rock n roll. The Stones had SOUL; the Beatles had arrangements and lots of chords, not to mention their cutesy factor. Still, I give them kudos for being creative on occasion.
You can still hear Stones classics on just about any jukebox or classic rock station.
Lennon and McCartney were heavily influenced by British Music Hall silliness and Tin Pan Alley which the Stones didn’t care about.
George was the only one with any talent.
People have said I’m nuts to suggest the Beatles were influenced by British music hall tunes of the ‘20s and ‘30s. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
Yeah the two guys who wrote most of the songs had no talen. /sarc
It bothered me for a day or so when he died but at that time my job was finding teens who had run away from home somewhere in America and were thought to be hanging out in the under layers of the city...a dangerous place for a sixteen year old from Podunk (not me - the kids I was looking for). I was spending too much time with the real danger and darkness of lost souls to let it get to me for more than a day.
Then he didn't know what he was saying because "hallelujah" has the name of the God of Israel in it, not any Hindus.
I got the sarcasm thing, but still the Beatles had NO soul as the Stones and many others out of the small Britain pubs had (think Kinks and others).
The Stones even named their band after a Muddy Waters song. "Englands Newest Hit Makers" album came out just months after the Beatles were singing, "I Want To Hold Your Hand". The Beatles were bubble-gum when the Stones were doing "Little Red Rooster" (major blues rendition).
Their next album, "Out of Our Heads" was a classic. Then you get "Aftermath", which the song "Going Home" was an 11 minute (or so) ad-lib by the band.
The Stones were covering Muddy Waters, Lil Walter, Willie Dixon, Chuck Berry, et al. (MONA, was their version of tribute to Bo Diddly). The Beatles were still singing about "PS, I Love You. The Stones took the Chess sound even further and became as big as the Beatles and continued long after they couldn't keep their shit together. I doubt they would have ever found any SOUL in their music. It was too over-produced. Give me straight forward ROCK anytime. I love Billy Idol's cover of "Mony, Mony".
I grew up that era. The Beatles were pu**ies. The Stones were the earliest bad boys of Rock n Roll and wrote songs that make you want to tap your foot to this day.
When's the last time you heard, "I Want To Hold Your Hand", or "Please, Please Me", or "Day In A Life..." or even later "Imagine" or ANY so-called rock song by the Beatles on ANY classic rock radio station? Even their rockin song, "Back in the USSR" had their stupid lecturing lyrics (commie at that)?
But yet you hear, "Satisfaction" or "Jumpin Jack Flash" or "Honky Tonk Woman" or "Gimme Shelter" or "Start Me Up" or "Tumbling Dice" or all the friggin time.
The Stones were the earliest rock n roll band to build on the early Chess Records that included Muddy Waters, Berry, Howlin' Wolf, et al.
The Beatles were for girls and later wimpy hippies. The Stones have always been (for good or bad) rock n rollers. Hell, they still rock even as old and grey-haired farts. The Beatles were a self-absorbed pop band. The Stones have always been about ROCK, even if 4 chords. Not to mention, Jagger/Richards wrote what I believe to be the best opening rift ever in "Gimme Shelter" (even if the song was a little about hippie crap). Or thing about the opening rifts to "Honky Tonk Woman" or "Sympathy for the Devil". The Beatles never got close to such rifts. Why? They didn't have Keith Richards.
"I met a gin-soaked bar-room queen in Memphis..." Maybe not good for our moral fiber, but rocks better than, "I saw the news today...oboy (whine,whine)".
Rolling Stones: "Aftermath" (June 1966).
Paint It Black (dark, forboding, catchy with the first use of a sitar on a rock tune - where were the Beatles?); Lady Jane (not as good but interesting take on Britain's history and first with a dulcimer - where were the Beatles?); Under My Thumb (catchy with an African xylophone - first ever in rock - where were the Beatles?). Going Home, THE first ad-lib tune in rock history where they continued after the obvious end of the song (where were the Beatles?) No where.
Everyone believes the Beatles to be the innovators in Rock from the Chuck Berry days and/or the Shirelles, Contours, Platters, et al. Sorry, I was there and being a musician at the time could tell who were experimenting with the Blues and Rock, and changing the chords and arrangements around that hit you in the heart of your Soul. Maybe the Beatles did in their Cave in Liverpool, but the first international band to do it on their recordings were The ROLLING STONES.
Deal with it. The Stones had soul in their very first album while the Beatles were still chewing on their bubblegum.
In case you forget, ROCK is built on soul, and should hit you in the deepest part of your being. Many can write lyrics that seem important, but guitar rifts, drum licks, bass lines, and melodie-matching lyrics is what Rock is.
If it's all about lyrics to you, then that is about poetry and NOT Rock n Roll. Think Joan Jett's, "I Love Rock n Roll". Stupid lyrics, but just nasty a** rock rhythm.
My point is that you can love what makes you feel good, but I lose patience with those (not you) who try to tell me how cutting-edge the Beatles were for ROCK. They weren't.
However, will admit they were cutting-edge POP musicians, but not ROCK! Fair?
I think his world view would be much different now than it was up until then. I doubt he would’ve been on board with Soros, Cindy Sheehan, Huffington, Maher and the rest...He might even be a golfing ditto-head!
“Deal with it. The Stones had soul in their very first album while the Beatles were still chewing on their bubblegum.”
Gee, d’ya think Brian Epstein had anything at all to do with that???
The Beatles used the Sitar on Rubber Soul in 1965. The Beatles also used feeback in 1964 (I Feel Fine) before anyeone else. The Stones didn’t even start writing their own songs until they saw the Beatles do it. For you it all boils down to how blues influenced the band was and the more the better - that’s fine but it’s not a criteria I much care about. The Blues do little for me.
The song wraps up with these lyrics:
Hm, my lord (hallelujah)
My, my, my lord (hare krishna)
My sweet lord (hare krishna)
My sweet lord (krishna krishna)
My lord (hare hare)
Hm, hm (Gurur Brahma)
Hm, hm (Gurur Vishnu)
Hm, hm (Gurur Devo)
Hm, hm (Maheshwara)
My sweet lord (Gurur Sakshaat)
My sweet lord (Parabrahma)
My, my, my lord (Tasmayi Shree)
My, my, my, my lord (Guruve Namah)
My sweet lord (Hare Rama)
It doesn't matter too much except for the person pushing false religion and anyone moved to false religion because of it. It matters a lot to them, going astray.
He does say "hallelujah" several times in the song. George Harrison was sued for plagiarism over that song - it was claimed that he ripped the tune off of the Chiffon's "He's So Fine" - I think he had to surrender all the royalties for it. Harrison said he was inspired by the Christian song "Oh Happy Day."
Are you ever right about anything?
Sorry for being a hater.
But the point is Beethoven and Wagner, same as Lennon, owe recognition and gratitude to the Good Lord for giving them what they need to make music.
“He’s so fine”, I never noticed the similarity. Hard to compare a doo-wop song with a 70s hit.
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