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To: rwilson99

Just use the scriptural examples.

Afterall, is there any record of souls, of the deceased, being conscious and having interaction with anyone other than God (i.e. the transfiguration), except the sad King Saul/spirit of Samuel event?

Jesus said that Jarius’ daughter was asleep, while everyone present knew that she had died.

He told his disciples that deceased Lazarus was asleep.

A sidenote: The unrelated rich man/Lazarus parable is spiritual instruction on righteousness and faithfulness, and pointing out the hardness of hearts that won’t believe ‘though one rise from the dead’. And notice, ‘Lazarus’ (who was carried by angels to ‘Abraham’s bosom’) does not respond, nor is there any indication that he hears the plea of the rich man; there is only the response from ‘Abraham’.

After the Christ died, some of the ‘saints which slept arose’ and came out of their graves (just WOW! and I bet they looked perfectly healthy, not like ‘night of the living dead’ or ‘thriller’).

“...we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep........the dead in Christ shall rise first”. 1Thess. 4:15,16

My personal belief is that, just like deep sleep, or a coma, there is no knowledge of time passing. When a saint dies, though a thousand years go by, the next conscious moment (which will seem like the same day) will be the uniting with other saints and meeting the Lord in heaven.

As far as visions by those that have ‘died’ and been brought back to life; when the brain goes short on oxygen, halucinations can result. Physically, you’re dead when your blood is dead.


62 posted on 12/04/2010 6:57:58 AM PST by Zuriel (Acts 2:38,39....nearly 2,000 years and still working today!)
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To: Zuriel

You do realize that the parable of Lazarus and Abraham as told by Jesus reveals a couple things that non-Catholics might find uncomfortable to accept.

First, the angels take Lazarus’ body to Abraham’s bosom and not to God. Why? Abraham is the “father” of the Jewish faithful. Note that Abraham is awake and able to hear and see the rich man.

Second, Abraham’s response to the rich man is that there is a chasm separating the two places, and even if one were to desire to cross from one place to the other, one couldn’t. In order to have such a desire, one would have to have an awareness of one’s situation.

Third, the rich man does not cry out to Lazarus, rather his prayer is directed to Abraham. He asks Abraham to send Lazarus to his brothers so that they will not end up in the same place. Abraham does not refuse for the reason that he cannot do such, rather, Abraham refuses because he says the brothers will not believe since they have not believed after having heard Moses and the prophets.

There are many lessons in this parable, which is typical of all parables. Hardness of heart is but one of them.

Sidenote: I have attended many protestant funerals and at each and every one the preacher/minister says quite unequivocally that the deceased is in heaven, Praise be to God.

So which is it? Does the soul of the deceased reside in heaven with Jesus or does the soul merely exist in limbo awaiting the final day whereupon it will learn its eternal fate?


71 posted on 12/04/2010 8:57:49 AM PST by Jvette
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To: Zuriel

My personal belief is that Mary is alive as promised and it is perfectly valid to ask her to pray for us.

I still don’t see anything about sleeping or going into a coma in John 3:16.


81 posted on 12/04/2010 10:27:39 AM PST by rwilson99
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