At this time, I am offering up a prayer for all of the participants on this thread that they will treat one another with love ... even in disagreement.
God bless you all and have a very Merry Christmas.
That bears repeating.
When I saw the title and the OP's name, it wasn't difficult to predict what the real substance the thread was, and how it would degenerate. It's so typical of this place.
It's also rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
While the various factions inceasingly hurl at the others whatever accusation is handy, whether it be true or false, our formerly (at least nominally) Christian culture continues to slip away. Our families are in decay, with rising divorce and illegitimacy rates; pornography and blasphemy permeate our art and entertainment; unborn children continue to be exterminated; the liberals are beyond hope, and the conservatives seem to have no stomach for cultural or even Constitutional preservation. In the name of some imagined "national security", we entangle ourselves in unwinnable wars, which we can't afford because we're already financially (as well as morally) bankrupt, due to the corruption of our economic system; and in the same name both sides of aisle will do nothing to reign in the erosion of our rights by a Leviathan government which has embraced a kind of soft totalitarianism.
Where can we realistically turn in hope except to the Word Made Flesh, the Incarnation which we are preparing during this Advent season to celebrate? And yet, what do we find here? Self-identified Christians who can think of nothing better to do than to sling mud at one another, apparently under the assumption that if enough is slung, something's bound to stick. Neither side cares to seek to understand the other, dare I say it, to love the other, to say nothing of working out a modus vivendi; it's just a matter of scoring points, of counting coup. Is this some religious variant of the silly idea that "he who dies having scored the most points, wins"? Wins what, exactly? It can't be eternal life, because that requires actually keeping the Commandments rather than luxuriating in the deadliest of the Seven Deadly Sins, viz., pride.
Do you know the carol "I Heard the Bells on Christmas Day"? The lyrics are attributed to Henry Wadsworth Longfellow. Typically, we only get to hear the first two verses:
I Heard the Bells on Christmas Day
Their old familiar carols play,
And wild and sweet the words repeat
Of peace on earth, good will to men.I thought how, as the day had come,
The belfries of all Christendom
Had rolled along the unbroken song
Of peace on earth, good will to men.
But the third verse is darker in tone:
And in despair I bowed my head:
"There is no peace on earth," I said,
"For hate is strong and mocks the song
Of peace on earth, good will to men."
This is where the Religion Forum is mired, and has been, apparently, for years. The question is, will the exigencies of our political and cultural situation motivate us to move past this point, or not? Because the carol doesn't end there; it goes on:
Then pealed the bells more loud and deep:
"God is not dead, nor doth he sleep;
The wrong shall fail, the right prevail,
With peace on earth, good will to men."Till, ringing singing, on its way,
The world revolved from night to day,
A voice, a chime, a chant sublime,
Of peace on earth, good will to men!
I long for the day, especially in this holy season, when we can say together:
"O, House of Jacob, come!
Let us walk in the light of the Lord."
(Is. 2:5)
Is this some religious variant of the silly idea that "he who dies having scored the most points, wins"? Wins what, exactly?It can't be eternal life, because that requires actually keeping the Commandments rather than luxuriating in the deadliest of the Seven Deadly Sins, viz., pride.
Then pealed the bells more loud and deep:
"God is not dead, nor doth he sleep;
The wrong shall fail, the right prevail,
With peace on earth, good will to men."
Nice pious rant...
You apparently unwittingly gave the reason for these discussions that are so tasteless to you...
because that requires actually keeping the Commandments
It appears you have failed to understand why Jesus became our Sacrifice and died for us...Jesus died because He knew we could not keep the Commandments....
And just as your song points out,
The wrong shall fail, the right prevail
we are not all in an ecumenical, all religons are OK, lovefest...
When folks believe they can obtain eternal life (in heaven) by their own good deeds, as keeping the Commandments entails, they are in the 'wrong shall fail' group...
It is our duty as Christians to lead to those to God's word that they may know the way to eternal life...