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To: Logophile; restornu; Paragon Defender; Godzilla; All
I think you have misunderstood the meaning of the word gospel. [Logophile]

Lds.org glossary partial definition of gospel (you know, the place Paragon Defender always tells us to go for to search for camels who are hidden in the needles of haystacks):
The central doctrine of the gospel is the Atonement of Jesus Christ.

From the article: NEVER does the Book of Mormon hint that there are sins beyond the cleansing power of Christ's blood.

Q. Doesn't the "atonement," the supposed "central doctrine of the" Mormon "gospel" have anything to do with how extensive or which sins are cleansed by his blood?

And when Brigham Young taught that certain sins would not be under "The blood of Christ" -- that His blood "will never wipe that out, your own blood must atone for it; and the judgments of the Almighty will come, sooner or later, and every man and woman will have to atone for breaking their covenants" ... (Discourses of Brigham Young, p.385). pray tell...why is that widely known as "blood atonement"???

Here...
...the Book of Mormon knowns of no limiting power as to which sins the atonement would cleanse....
...& Brigham taught there was such a limit, and that self-blood trumps Jesus' blood on some sins...
...But it's all related to various teachings of the atonement...
...An atonement which Lds.org says is the "central doctrine of the gospel"...
...And then you accuse me of misfiring on my definition of the Mormon "gospel"...
...Can you say...
...Disconnect???...
...Lack of intellectual integrity OR horrific apologetics' application & faulty accusation on your part...?

And then we're also supposed to do the mental gymnastics you've done and conclude that Lds "apostle" Bruce McConkie's quote from the article is also somehow "irrelevant" to the Mormon doctrine of the "atonement?" (Yes? No?)

McConkie: "But under certain circumstances there are some serious sins for which the cleansing of Christ> does not operate, and the law of God is that men must have their own blood shed to ATONE for their sins" (Mormon Doctrine, pg. 92).

So you're SERIOUSLY telling us that McConkie's use of the word "atone" here has NOTHING to do with the Lds usage of "atonement," which in turn is the central doctrine of the Mormon gospel per Lds.org?

All so that you can keep intact Smith's repeated canonized claim that the Book of Mormon contains the "fulness" of the everlasting gospel?

Tell you what? Show some intellectual integrity. Have you considered your choices here...of either telling us...
...you concede the Book of Mormon has indeed failed to convey the "fulness" of the everlasting "gospel," Mormon-style, as it pertains to a full teaching on the atonement.
...Or...you can just label before all of us that Brigham Young and Bruce McConkie were false "prophets" on at least the teaching of the atonement.

Who lied in a false "prophet" way? Joseph Smith in the D&C? Or Brigham Young & Bruce McConkie in other venues?

(Your third choice...accusing me of misdialing the number for defining the Mormon "gospel" misfired and failed to hit the mark...unless you want to accuse Paragon Defender's fave link of flunking in its definition of the Mormon "gospel")

34 posted on 11/15/2010 12:41:46 AM PST by Colofornian ("So how do LDS deal with the [Adam-God] phenomenon? WE DON'T; WE SIMPLY SET IT ASIDE" - BYU prof)
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To: Colofornian; All
Seekers of truth,

If you peruse the Free Republic religion forums you will notice a pattern. There's an anti-Mormon group of people here that spends a great deal of their time attacking the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They post regurgitated propaganda on an almost daily basis.

They have a misguided obsession. You can witness many different tactics employed that you might find quite interesting. The straw man argument is a big favorite and is frequently preceded by cherry-picking quotes or other material. After the "quotation" the attacker will misrepresent what has been said or what was meant and then attack their own interpretation.Later they will have the audacity to claim they were "only" quoting our own material.  

They will of course insist ad nauseum that they are merely using our sources and are therefore innocent of any deceptive practice. LDS persons have no issue whatsoever having our scriptures or leaders quoted as long as it is presented fairly and accurately. This is rarely (if ever) done.

Another favorite is posting scripture or statements which on their own really present no dilemma. They make something out of nothing while never bringing up a single objection that hasn't been addressed a hundred times before.

You might note a couple of other tactics used to try to antagonize is the use of disrespectful or insulting terms or language and/or pictures. That's a Christlike thing to do right? Yeah I don't think so either. It does speak volumes about them though.

Sometimes they cruise the headlines of the day seeking any story that might be twisted into making the Church look bad. Anything will do, just watch the progression of posts following it and see what I mean.

After reading their posts, I invite you to seek the truth about whatever "issue" they seem to be "revealing" or "exposing". I promise that if you do so with honest intent, the "ahah" moments you will have will be many and frequent. You will start to recognize the tactics employed to cleverly twist and attack and will likely chuckle the more you see. In actuality, there's nothing new here. It's all been addressed many times before.

The latest twist in the anti-Mormon propaganda machine is to actually go to the links provided, but then they cherry pick what they want, then quote and straw man attack that. Clever. It almost appears that they are helping you, the seeker of truth out by doing some footwork for you. Not so much. Don't be insulted, look for yourself. It's not the haystack they want you to think.

Here's a few links to get your started from a different viewpoint. I have found that the vast majority of the "issues" brought up can be found and addressed at http://www.fairlds.org/ but here's more:

http://scriptures.lds.org/
http://www.lds.org
http://www.fairlds.org/
http://www.mormonapologetics.org/
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Main_Page
http://www.lightplanet.com/response/index.html
http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDS_Intro.shtml
http://www.answeringantimormons.com/index.htm
http://promormon.blogspot.com/

Now you will likely notice the "you never address our points" posts pop up as usual. All after providing the answers just as you have here.

Sometimes it is claimed that these sites present a needle in a haystack. Far from it. But if you give up before you try you won't know will you?

Will you wear blinders too? Seek truth. Find out for yourself. Want to chat with someone on any topic? A few of these sites provide just that. So do your homework sincere seeker of truth. Listen and read from both "sides". Make up your own mind.

I witness to you of these truths and wish you the best, in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Amen.

 


37 posted on 11/15/2010 4:00:54 AM PST by Paragon Defender
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To: Colofornian; Logophile

I think you have misunderstood the meaning of the word gospel. [Logophile]

***

I am not sure but when one uses “I think you” is one is mindreading.


54 posted on 11/15/2010 6:48:52 AM PST by restornu
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