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To: daniel1212
the official Roman Catholic Bible

Says "Pœnitentiam agite". The only official Bible is the Latin translation or the Greek original. The Greek original says μετανοειτε.

The only guidance of whether μετανοειτε refers to a physical act of penance is in the acts of St. John the Baptist. St. Peter, as Acts 2:38 reports, likewise directed the Jews to baptism for the remission of their sins. To suggest that the "changing of the mind" was purely an intellectual exercise is not biblical.

In Acts 26:20, “that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet [corresponding to] for repentance.” -- corroborates the fact that the Bible teaches "metanoia" as something people DO rather than think or feel. "Do penance" is the proper translation, it reflects the active nature of true penance.

6,913 posted on 01/07/2011 10:32:59 PM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: annalex
To suggest that the "changing of the mind" was purely an intellectual exercise is not biblical

Penance is not Biblical Annalex....Jesus Christ either bore the penalty for all our sins...or none at all...there is no half-way measures He weighed in on. There is nothing more that we can do which can or would satisfy the requirements of God.

But Rome will continue this requirement for it's members as doing so creates a false sense of being forgiven and of course fills the coffers of the church.

Let the 'mind' that was in Christ Jesus be in you. The scriptures speak often of the re-newing of our minds.

6,915 posted on 01/07/2011 10:59:09 PM PST by caww
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To: annalex; daniel1212
"The only guidance of whether μετανοειτε refers to a physical act of penance is in the acts of St. John the Baptist. St. Peter, as Acts 2:38 reports, likewise directed the Jews to baptism for the remission of their sins. To suggest that the "changing of the mind" was purely an intellectual exercise is not biblical."

The novel idea that μετανοειτε or μετανοια means only an abstract intellectual exercise is nonsense. Indeed, there is a form of veneration, a deep bow from the waist while touching the floor with the fingers of the right hand, called a "metania" and a full body prostration (the great metania) of the sort we use while saying reciting the great penitential Prayer of +Ephraim the Syrian. Both words are obviously find their root in μετανοια.

BTW, imagine a congregation doing 3 full body prostrations while reciting this:

"O Lord and Master of my life, give me not the spirit of sloth, idle curiosity, lust for power and idle talk.[prostration]

But grant unto me, Thy servant, a spirit of chastity, humility, patience and love.[prostration]

Yea, O Lord and King, grant me to see my own faults and not to judge my brother. For blessed art Thou unto the ages of ages. Amen."[prostration]

We do this in Great Lent. Μετανοια, indeed, means more than simply changing one's mind about life and one's relationship to God. It means at least self examination followed by intense penitential prayer and even physical action.

6,917 posted on 01/08/2011 6:18:25 AM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated)
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To: annalex
Says "Pœnitentiam agite". The only official Bible is the Latin translation or the Greek original. The Greek original says μετανοειτε.

The NAB is the official Bible of the U.S. Conference of Bishops. EWTN site says, “There is only one English text currently approved by the Church for use in the United States. This text is the one contained in the Lectionaries approved for Sundays & Feasts and for Weekdays by the USCCB and recognized by the Holy See. These Lectionaries have their American and Roman approval documents in the front. The text is that of the New American Bible with revised Psalms and New Testament (1988, 1991), with some changes mandated by the Holy See where the NAB text used so-called vertical inclusive language (e.g. avoiding male pronouns for God). Since these Lectionaries have been fully promulgated, the permission to use the Jerusalem Bible and the RSV-Catholic at Mass has been withdrawn. “

To suggest that the "changing of the mind" was purely an intellectual exercise is not biblical.

Indeed it is not, and I think you should have know i was not suggesting such, but a change of heart which resulted in a change of life.

In Acts 26:20, “that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet [corresponding to] for repentance.” -- corroborates the fact that the Bible teaches "metanoia" as something people DO rather than think or feel. "Do penance" is the proper translation, it reflects the active nature of true penance.

See http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2618333/posts?page=6922#6922 Again, not as if they were to put off being baptized until such the repaid debts, etc. Rather, the change in heart, from unbelief to being baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus — whose Lord ship Peter has just emphasized — was as significant as the a wedding vows. And thus they did “repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.” What is was not was Long before the Reformation the schoolmen debated the question whether complete "contrition" was or was not in itself sufficient to obtain the Divine pardon, versus formal acts of contrition, but there can be no end of things a soul sneed s to make right, and some have not the character to do them.,While God can convict souls to do certain things in preparation for conversion, (Acts 24:25) others have made some right choices and are saved in one day, as the 3k souls at Pentecost.

6,923 posted on 01/08/2011 8:14:13 PM PST by daniel1212 ( "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out," Acts 3:19)
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