Eucharist - Catacomb of San Callisto
Fractio Panis "the breaking of bread"), Greek Chapel, Catacomb of St. Priscilla, fresco, third century, on the arch over the altar tomb upon which the sacrament of the Eucharist was performed.
Posted on 10/31/2010 11:59:22 AM PDT by RnMomof7
In Christ Alone lyrics
Songwriters: Getty, Julian Keith; Townend, Stuart Richard;
In Christ alone my hope is found He is my light, my strength, my song This Cornerstone, this solid ground Firm through the fiercest drought and storm
What heights of love, what depths of peace When fears are stilled, when strivings cease My Comforter, my All in All Here in the love of Christ I stand
In Christ alone, who took on flesh Fullness of God in helpless Babe This gift of love and righteousness Scorned by the ones He came to save
?Til on that cross as Jesus died The wrath of God was satisfied For every sin on Him was laid Here in the death of Christ I live, I live
There in the ground His body lay Light of the world by darkness slain Then bursting forth in glorious Day Up from the grave He rose again
And as He stands in victory Sin?s curse has lost its grip on me For I am His and He is mine Bought with the precious blood of Christ
Then what, exactly, does the priest DO at the altar?
Is not the mass the participation in the sacrifice of Christ as other Catholics here have stated?
Or is the elaborate ceremony, which bears little resemblance to the Last Supper, just done in REMEMBRANCE after all?
As a professed ex-Catholic you should already know this. If you don't then your rejection of Catholicism was based upon your own ignorance and not on any shortcomings of the Church.
It can be called Mass, the Lord’s Supper, Holy Communion, and the Divine Liturgy. Eucharist is ancient term which describes the central act of Christian worship since the beginning of the Church.
http://www.goarch.org/chapel/liturgical_texts/liturgy_hchc
"Is not the mass the participation in the sacrifice of Christ as other Catholics here have stated?"
We don't put it that way, mm, though I know the Latins do. Over the centuries, the Latin's understanding of the role of the lower clergy at the Eucharist, and hierarchs, has diverged some from what we believe. For us, the Divine Liturgy is, among other things, a participation in the Mystery of the Incarnation, not simply in the passion and the crucifixion. It is also a communal remembrance of the Incarnation. Here's a link to an article for non-Orthodox which speaks about the Divine Liturgy:
http://www.goarch.org/ourfaith/ourfaith7077
Participation in the Divine Liturgy is a sublime spiritual encounter with the Trinity. The following quote from the report of Prince Vladimir's envoys sent out to find a faith for the people of Kiev, is in part in the piece by Fr. Fitzgerald, but I'm posting it here for those who don't read the article:
"When we journeyed among the Bulgars, we beheld how they worship in their temple, called a mosque, while they stand ungirt. The Bulgarian bows, sits down, looks hither and thither like one possessed, and there is no happiness among them, but instead only sorrow and a dreadful stench. Their religion is not good. Then we went among the Germans, and saw them performing many ceremonies in their temples; but we beheld no glory there. Then we went on to Greece, and the Greeks led us to the edifices where they worship their God, and we knew not whether we were in heaven or on earth. For on earth there is no such splendour or such beauty, and we are at a loss how to describe it. We know only that God dwells there among men, and their service is fairer than the ceremonies of other nations. For we cannot forget that beauty. Every man, after tasting something sweet, is afterward unwilling to accept that which is bitter, and therefore we cannot dwell longer here."
As a professed ex-Catholic you should already know this. If you don't then your rejection of Catholicism was based upon your own ignorance and not on any shortcomings of the Church.
Excellent point. This brings us back to Fulton Sheen's statement that there are many who hate what they believe the Church is; there are very few who actually hate what the Church is. Misunderstandings abound; if one leaves the Church because they don't understand it, does that actually make them culpable? Or are they the seeds strewn on the path?
“It’s a mystery”. That should cover all the bases.
One act divided into countless acts but one act. Understand? No? It’s a Mystery.
“1367 The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: “The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different.” “In this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner.” (Catholic Catechism)
Understand yet? After Christ had made the offering in heaven, Hebrews 9, the sacrifice is still being performed but now the bloody sacrifice has become an unbloody one but “one and the same” only differing in “the manner of offering”.
The same yet different. A Mystery. Understand now?
The sacrificial memorial of Christ and of his Body, the Church
1362 The Eucharist is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the making present and the sacramental offering of his unique sacrifice, in the liturgy of the Church which is his Body. In all the Eucharistic Prayers we find after the words of institution a prayer called the anamnesis or memorial.
1363 In the sense of Sacred Scripture the memorial is not merely the recollection of past events but the proclamation of the mighty works wrought by God for men.184 In the liturgical celebration of these events, they become in a certain way present and real. This is how Israel understands its liberation from Egypt: every time Passover is celebrated, the Exodus events are made present to the memory of believers so that they may conform their lives to them.
1364 In the New Testament, the memorial takes on new meaning. When the Church celebrates the Eucharist, she commemorates Christ's Passover, and it is made present the sacrifice Christ offered once for all on the cross remains ever present.185 "As often as the sacrifice of the Cross by which 'Christ our Pasch has been sacrificed' is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out."186
1365 Because it is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the Eucharist is also a sacrifice. The sacrificial character of the Eucharist is manifested in the very words of institution: "This is my body which is given for you" and "This cup which is poured out for you is the New Covenant in my blood."187 In the Eucharist Christ gives us the very body which he gave up for us on the cross, the very blood which he "poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins."188
1366 The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross, because it is its memorial and because it applies its fruit:
[Christ], our Lord and God, was once and for all to offer himself to God the Father by his death on the altar of the cross, to accomplish there an everlasting redemption. But because his priesthood was not to end with his death, at the Last Supper "on the night when he was betrayed," [he wanted] to leave to his beloved spouse the Church a visible sacrifice (as the nature of man demands) by which the bloody sacrifice which he was to accomplish once for all on the cross would be re-presented, its memory perpetuated until the end of the world, and its salutary power be applied to the forgiveness of the sins we daily commit.189 1367 The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: "The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different." "And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner. . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory."190
1368 The Eucharist is also the sacrifice of the Church. The Church which is the Body of Christ participates in the offering of her Head. With him, she herself is offered whole and entire. She unites herself to his intercession with the Father for all men. In the Eucharist the sacrifice of Christ becomes also the sacrifice of the members of his Body. The lives of the faithful, their praise, sufferings, prayer, and work, are united with those of Christ and with his total offering, and so acquire a new value. Christ's sacrifice present on the altar makes it possible for all generations of Christians to be united with his offering.
In the catacombs the Church is often represented as a woman in prayer, arms outstretched in the praying position. Like Christ who stretched out his arms on the cross, through him, with him, and in him, she offers herself and intercedes for all men.
1369 The whole Church is united with the offering and intercession of Christ. Since he has the ministry of Peter in the Church, the Pope is associated with every celebration of the Eucharist, wherein he is named as the sign and servant of the unity of the universal Church. The bishop of the place is always responsible for the Eucharist, even when a priest presides; the bishop's name is mentioned to signify his presidency over the particular Church, in the midst of his presbyterium and with the assistance of deacons. The community intercedes also for all ministers who, for it and with it, offer the Eucharistic sacrifice:
Let only that Eucharist be regarded as legitimate, which is celebrated under [the presidency of] the bishop or him to whom he has entrusted it.191 Through the ministry of priests the spiritual sacrifice of the faithful is completed in union with the sacrifice of Christ the only Mediator, which in the Eucharist is offered through the priests' hands in the name of the whole Church in an unbloody and sacramental manner until the Lord himself comes.192
1370 To the offering of Christ are united not only the members still here on earth, but also those already in the glory of heaven. In communion with and commemorating the Blessed Virgin Mary and all the saints, the Church offers the Eucharistic sacrifice. In the Eucharist the Church is as it were at the foot of the cross with Mary, united with the offering and intercession of Christ.
1371 The Eucharistic sacrifice is also offered for the faithful departed who "have died in Christ but are not yet wholly purified,"193 so that they may be able to enter into the light and peace of Christ:
Put this body anywhere! Don't trouble yourselves about it! I simply ask you to remember me at the Lord's altar wherever you are.194 Then, we pray [in the anaphora] for the holy fathers and bishops who have fallen asleep, and in general for all who have fallen asleep before us, in the belief that it is a great benefit to the souls on whose behalf the supplication is offered, while the holy and tremendous Victim is present. . . . By offering to God our supplications for those who have fallen asleep, if they have sinned, we . . . offer Christ sacrificed for the sins of all, and so render favorable, for them and for us, the God who loves man.195
1372 St. Augustine admirably summed up this doctrine that moves us to an ever more complete participation in our Redeemer's sacrifice which we celebrate in the Eucharist:
This wholly redeemed city, the assembly and society of the saints, is offered to God as a universal sacrifice by the high priest who in the form of a slave went so far as to offer himself for us in his Passion, to make us the Body of so great a head. . . . Such is the sacrifice of Christians: "we who are many are one Body in Christ" The Church continues to reproduce this sacrifice in the sacrament of the altar so well-known to believers wherein it is evident to them that in what she offers she herself is offered.196
Mystery? Sure. If you are not into mysteries, tell us exactly how the Trinity works; and how Jesus could raise himself from the dead. Then give us the explanation of virgin birth, or resurrection of the body, or a Heaven out of time. It is true that the Latins have tried more than the Orthodox to explain things, which is somewhat irritating, but the attempt at explanation does not make the mystery any less a mystery, and any less a portion of the required Faith.
Eucharist - Catacomb of San Callisto
Fractio Panis "the breaking of bread"), Greek Chapel, Catacomb of St. Priscilla, fresco, third century, on the arch over the altar tomb upon which the sacrament of the Eucharist was performed.
Why not “Holy Anamnesin” if we are doing the “this” Christ spoke of?
Shirley not while having degrees in Greek. No, no nononono.
Well...maybe.
Why not Holy Eucharist if you are thankful?
I believe the second illustration was meant to show the multiplication of the fish and loaves. Yes? No?
Quite likely the fish and loaves are involved in the symbolism, they are quite frequently used as is the number seven in the count of participants. There are also representations of “fishers of men” and of course the symbol for fish was used early on.
Here’s an article on the Spirituality of the Catacombs:
http://www.catacombe.roma.it/en/spiritualita.html
You may call it whatever you choose. It was Christ who said “remembrance”, the prayer of thanks and blessing (eucharist) came to be applied to whole later.
And Paul added that so long as the meal took place the death of Christ was proclaimed. (1 Cor. 11:26)
So call it what you wish but what is more descriptive and reflective of Christ’s command.
The Church chose Eucharist long ago. Along with remembrance there is also thanks in the scriptural reference: “For I received from the Lord what I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, “This is my body which is for you. Do this in remembrance of me.”
Paul also wrote concerning the Real Presence:
“The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not a participation in the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ?” …
“Therefore whoever eats the bread and drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. . . . For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself”
The Real Presence, the Holy Eucharist, is Christian worship from the beginning of the Church, from Christ’s command “This is my body which is for you. Do this..”.
When we reduce this sacrament, remove its sacredness, we have lost a great deal of what was and is Christian worship from the beginning.
And this change, this loss, is relatively very recent.
But in order to avoid any accusation of Snippetfication I will find a text of the Catholic Catechism in the public domain and post it to you in its ENTIRETY plus notes and references and then you may choose the relevant portions, if any. O.K.?
And in that same spirit of Non-Snippetfication I post your entire comment, complete, unabridged and unsnippeted.
“I see that you guys read the Catechism in the same snippet-like fashion that you read Scripture. Let us put it into context:
The sacrificial memorial of Christ and of his Body, the Church
1362 The Eucharist is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the making present and the sacramental offering of his unique sacrifice, in the liturgy of the Church which is his Body. In all the Eucharistic Prayers we find after the words of institution a prayer called the anamnesis or memorial.
1363 In the sense of Sacred Scripture the memorial is not merely the recollection of past events but the proclamation of the mighty works wrought by God for men.184 In the liturgical celebration of these events, they become in a certain way present and real. This is how Israel understands its liberation from Egypt: every time Passover is celebrated, the Exodus events are made present to the memory of believers so that they may conform their lives to them.
1364 In the New Testament, the memorial takes on new meaning. When the Church celebrates the Eucharist, she commemorates Christ's Passover, and it is made present the sacrifice Christ offered once for all on the cross remains ever present.185 “As often as the sacrifice of the Cross by which ‘Christ our Pasch has been sacrificed’ is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out.”186
1365 Because it is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the Eucharist is also a sacrifice. The sacrificial character of the Eucharist is manifested in the very words of institution: “This is my body which is given for you” and “This cup which is poured out for you is the New Covenant in my blood.”187 In the Eucharist Christ gives us the very body which he gave up for us on the cross, the very blood which he “poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.”188
1366 The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross, because it is its memorial and because it applies its fruit:
[Christ], our Lord and God, was once and for all to offer himself to God the Father by his death on the altar of the cross, to accomplish there an everlasting redemption. But because his priesthood was not to end with his death, at the Last Supper “on the night when he was betrayed,” [he wanted] to leave to his beloved spouse the Church a visible sacrifice (as the nature of man demands) by which the bloody sacrifice which he was to accomplish once for all on the cross would be re-presented, its memory perpetuated until the end of the world, and its salutary power be applied to the forgiveness of the sins we daily commit.189 1367 The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: “The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different.” “And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner. . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory.”190
1368 The Eucharist is also the sacrifice of the Church. The Church which is the Body of Christ participates in the offering of her Head. With him, she herself is offered whole and entire. She unites herself to his intercession with the Father for all men. In the Eucharist the sacrifice of Christ becomes also the sacrifice of the members of his Body. The lives of the faithful, their praise, sufferings, prayer, and work, are united with those of Christ and with his total offering, and so acquire a new value. Christ's sacrifice present on the altar makes it possible for all generations of Christians to be united with his offering.
In the catacombs the Church is often represented as a woman in prayer, arms outstretched in the praying position. Like Christ who stretched out his arms on the cross, through him, with him, and in him, she offers herself and intercedes for all men.
1369 The whole Church is united with the offering and intercession of Christ. Since he has the ministry of Peter in the Church, the Pope is associated with every celebration of the Eucharist, wherein he is named as the sign and servant of the unity of the universal Church. The bishop of the place is always responsible for the Eucharist, even when a priest presides; the bishop's name is mentioned to signify his presidency over the particular Church, in the midst of his presbyterium and with the assistance of deacons. The community intercedes also for all ministers who, for it and with it, offer the Eucharistic sacrifice:
Let only that Eucharist be regarded as legitimate, which is celebrated under [the presidency of] the bishop or him to whom he has entrusted it.191 Through the ministry of priests the spiritual sacrifice of the faithful is completed in union with the sacrifice of Christ the only Mediator, which in the Eucharist is offered through the priests’ hands in the name of the whole Church in an unbloody and sacramental manner until the Lord himself comes.192
1370 To the offering of Christ are united not only the members still here on earth, but also those already in the glory of heaven. In communion with and commemorating the Blessed Virgin Mary and all the saints, the Church offers the Eucharistic sacrifice. In the Eucharist the Church is as it were at the foot of the cross with Mary, united with the offering and intercession of Christ.
1371 The Eucharistic sacrifice is also offered for the faithful departed who “have died in Christ but are not yet wholly purified,”193 so that they may be able to enter into the light and peace of Christ:
Put this body anywhere! Don't trouble yourselves about it! I simply ask you to remember me at the Lord's altar wherever you are.194 Then, we pray [in the anaphora] for the holy fathers and bishops who have fallen asleep, and in general for all who have fallen asleep before us, in the belief that it is a great benefit to the souls on whose behalf the supplication is offered, while the holy and tremendous Victim is present. . . . By offering to God our supplications for those who have fallen asleep, if they have sinned, we . . . offer Christ sacrificed for the sins of all, and so render favorable, for them and for us, the God who loves man.195
1372 St. Augustine admirably summed up this doctrine that moves us to an ever more complete participation in our Redeemer's sacrifice which we celebrate in the Eucharist:
This wholly redeemed city, the assembly and society of the saints, is offered to God as a universal sacrifice by the high priest who in the form of a slave went so far as to offer himself for us in his Passion, to make us the Body of so great a head. . . . Such is the sacrifice of Christians: “we who are many are one Body in Christ” The Church continues to reproduce this sacrifice in the sacrament of the altar so well-known to believers wherein it is evident to them that in what she offers she herself is offered.196
Mystery? Sure. If you are not into mysteries, tell us exactly how the Trinity works; and how Jesus could raise himself from the dead. Then give us the explanation of virgin birth, or resurrection of the body, or a Heaven out of time. It is true that the Latins have tried more than the Orthodox to explain things, which is somewhat irritating, but the attempt at explanation does not make the mystery any less a mystery, and any less a portion of the required Faith.”
Such is not taught in the Scriptures.
cyc, even I can spell Αναμνηση, and it is well known that I cannot spell worth beans. You got the form wrong. The form you posted would be used in "εις ανάμνησην" , In memory of. You should have posted "Holy Anamnese", so, H Θεια Αναμνηση, as an alternative to Η Θεία Ευχαριστία or Η Θεία Λειτουργία . There's probably no reason we cannot do that. But we don't.
It is good, however, to see you trying! :)
Your posting was a snippet of the Catechism, much like many Protestant justifications for theology from Scriptures, and just about as valid. I posted enough of the surrounding Catechism to put it into context. Remember that it is possible justify all first millennium heresies from Scripture (although not the Calvinist heresies and the resulting derivatives).
Such is not taught in the Scriptures.
Many things are not taught in the Scriptures but the Protestant pantheon variously will believe in them - such as the Trinity, transubstantiation, the mission of St. Thomas the Unbeliever to India, and also various falsehoods such as the existence of full siblings of Jesus, the journeys of Jesus and Joseph of Arimathea to Britain, and so on.
1. The Holy Spirit was present. Palpably. Even over the din of restless children.
2. The people were there for one reason. To worship and take part in the eternal. Not because it’s just what they do on Sundays, not to be seen, not to take part in a Jesus pep rally and be patted on the back for their piety or their pretty singing. To worship.
3. The people loved each other. And they were genuinely welcoming to new faces.
I hadn’t perceived all three simultaneously in either the Southern Baptist church of my youth or the United Methodist church of my adulthood in years. Decades.
Isn’t it extraordinary, K? The Liturgical Practices of the Eastern Churches are nearly 2,000 years old – but they don’t get stale. THEY DON’T GET STALE. Protestant churches will change their order of worship multiple times in a year. They have those “contemporary” services.
The ancient Church is very much alive and well. In spite of the fact that it very generally speaking will not defend itself with swords or guns. Merely by the power of the Spirit and the Righteous Bodiless Powers of Heaven. And it is alive.
The Jews tried to abort it. They failed.
The Romans tried to squash it. They failed.
The Heretics tried to sidetrack it. They failed.
The Muslims tried to intimidate it, contain it, run it off, and kill it. They failed.
The Popes of Rome tried to subjugate it. They failed.
The Bolsheviks tried to purge it. They failed.
The Reformers still hilariously and needlessly try to “save” it. Gospodi pomiluj. They fail.
There is a reason for that.
Ps 23:4
Rom 8:31
We don't make judgements about where the Spirit is not. It goes where it will.
But we do know where to find it. We know where it is.
I haven't forgotten my “eis” when it should’ve read “estin”
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.